January 8th, 2014

SKETCH: ‘Ello, ‘Ello PAC

Something a bit fishy about the Met Commissioner Bernard Hogan-Howe. It’s only a hunch based on years of snap and unsubstantiated judgements but I’d arrest him.

It wasn’t just the bitey exchanges with the MPs on the Public Administration Committee. Truth to tell, the committee didn’t distinguish itself and it would be easy to get impatient with them.

No, the man talks too much, and too often to conceal rather than reveal.

During a previous committee appearance he had quoted a report which said the Met’s performance had been just fine. But in fact, the report had said Met performance gave “cause for concern”.

Hogan-Howe’s explanation ran for a full fifty feet of videotape but is summarised as – “I was quoting from the executive summary and the criticism was in the text of the report.”

The verbal slurry helped conceal the fact that the author of said report was Bernard Hogan-Howe himself. But then, why didn’t he remember what was in it?

He had forgotten that he’d written it.

He’d FORGOTTEN he’d – ?

Just turn off the tape and let me question him around the kidneys, Sarge.

On the matter of fiddled crime statistics, had Hogan-Howe spoken to whistleblower PC Patrick as he told the committee he would?

More low-value verbalising. No, he hadn’t specifically spoken to him as such, not personally. And why not? Apart from it being Christmas?

Actually, they had approached him after his whistleblowing appearance in order to “enquire about his welfare”.

That had been interpreted by the committee clerk as “trying to interfere with his evidence”. So, obviously, having said he wanted to talk to him he couldn’t talk directly to him in person, as such.

And then obviously Hogan-Howe couldn’t speak to him about fiddled crime statsistics because PC Patrick is up on charges of gross misconduct for publishing evidence about fiddled crime statistics.

The lesson from all this? “We need to learn what we can do to support whistleblowers.”

Support them, you see, not “enquire after their welfare”. And the welfare of their children. Lovely looking little ones.

Bernard Jenkin (whose hair is a crime category in itself) remarked that PC Patrick had been producing evidence of corrupt crime reporting for months and years and only after his committee appearance did Hogan-Howe take an interest in the matter.

More slurry.

Hogan-Howe is an odd one all right.

The committee didn’t nail him this time. But life is long, and time, no doubt, will tell.


221 Comments

  1. 1
    maurice saatchi says:

    i am boris johnson’s twin and I am rich.

  2. 2
    But She Does Not Agree with the Jury says:

  3. 3
    simple simon says:

    i am gooey bob and i use a bob or two to get the word out. i lack wood.

  4. 4
    Met Police FC says:

    We do what we want, we do what we waaaa-aanntttt,
    We’re the Met Police, we do what we want………

  5. 5
    Comment Diane? says:

  6. 6
    i seek religion says:

    i hide behind abbott.
    mission abort dear.

  7. 7
    Arrest Them says:

  8. 8
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    Here we go, the media are talking up more riots.

  9. 9
    Whippersnapper2 says:

    He should have been arrested and tried already for the Mitchelgate cover up and police lies and lies and lies and more lies.

  10. 10
    Brrrrrrap! says:

    Lock your doors, innit, blud?!!!!!!!!!!!

  11. 11
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    For once Abbott it would be sensible to keep your mouth shut.

  12. 12
    At least they didn't call them Gay says:

  13. 13
    ass calling piss says:

    are on the take?

    sc: needs unplugging.

  14. 14
    Charles Menezes says:

    Too cold, not gonna happen.

  15. 15
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    Does anyone listen to Abbott News?

  16. 16
    Susanne says:

    Very surprised that an MP could so actively be in contempt of Court.

    I doubt Diane will face prison though – think of the strain on the taxpayers catering budget at HMP if she did.

    Woman is humungous.

  17. 17
    the volunteer says:

    It is a true thing to say that there has been a dislocation between what is considered socially correct/ lawful ( see I separated those two because one is not the other) when the dislocation is evident within plod, has been recently demonstrated, then you can accurately state the fabric of society is falling apart.

  18. 18
    Diane Abbott M.P. says:

    But, there’s a populist bandwagon to be ridden to get a few votes?

  19. 19
    Londoner says:

    The police have had their helicopter up over North London for most of the afternoon. And yes, it can jam your wifi.

  20. 20
    Whippersnapper2 says:

    You mean like Nigella got justice being put on trial for being a voluntary Crown witness by some moronic judge. That sort of justice you mean? The defence claims should never have been allowed after the first few words but our judges are pathetic. Lowest of low standards.

  21. 21
    Susanne says:

    I sense that certain members of the community want an excuse for some new trainers and flatscreen TVs.

    Animals.

  22. 22
    Richard Smith says:

    If you want to see zero help or support for whistle blowers you should look at the information commissioners office. They are totally open with those complained about, fail to protect witnesses, and are generally a naïve pushover. They may as well not exist in their current form as they are only dealing with easy cases, the biggest abusers are pretty much immune from them.

  23. 23
    Brrrrrrap! says:

    Mark Duggan’s aunt Carole Duggan says her nephew was “executed” and she will fight for justice

  24. 24
    the volunteer says:

    yes well ok I should probably say ” the law as written and the social law”

  25. 25
    Iain Duncan-Smith says:

    Universal Credit will be delivered on time and on budget.

  26. 26
    confession time says:

    I am john Humphries and I am bent.

  27. 27
    Grumpy Old Man says:

    If the woman had any sense she would enter a Trappist convent.

  28. 28
    Just sayin' says:

    Mr Duggan was a father of five. That’s way too young to be a father imho.

  29. 29
    Anonymous says:

    Is there any danger of us having a report into Michelgate at some point ? the whole thing is an embarassment, which other country would still be fannying around if an elected MP had been set up by the Police ?

  30. 30
    Ed the Eunuch says:

    If the police are not full of stupidity they are corrupt!

  31. 31
    Ed Moribund says:

    Universal Credit has gone 4% over time budget! its a clocks of living crisis!

  32. 32
    The poublic says:

    I have not been shot by the Met.
    Then again, I haven’t been a criminal riding around with a handgun.

  33. 33
    Iain Duncan-Smith says:

    Universal Credit will be delivered on time and on budget.

  34. 34
    A Nasty unpleasant people says:

    Blimey. Those Duggans are a violent lot.

  35. 35
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    Why did Mark Duggan have a gun in the first place?

  36. 36
    The Guardian says:

    Met police want water cannon ready to use in Britain by summer

  37. 37
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    I think its pretty clear that duggon didn’t throw the gun over the fence

  38. 38
    Abbott wants Riots says:

  39. 39
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    And was Mark Duggan going to execute someone?

  40. 40
    Common sense says:

    The media really are trying their best to create something more out of this. They should wait to see the transcript to see why the jury concluded Duggan did not have the gun in his hand at the time of the shooting. The time line is so important. Specialised armed police follow and stop car containing extremely dangerous armed man. If he exited the car quickly and threw the gun, the police would only have seen an object thrown and would not be able to wait to confirm what was thrown. It would now be dependent on Duggans compliance to orders which would determine how the situation continued. If he did not comply and made to escape/raise his arms etc he is a legitamate target. As for Abbot she should know better.

  41. 41
    JohnM says:

    They are both!

  42. 42
    Ed Moribund says:

    Universal Credit has gone 4% over time budget! its a clocks of living crisis!
    ONENASHIONLABOUR

  43. 43
    Common sense says:

    As for that rabble who intimidated threatened that officer giving a statement. Shhot the effin lot

  44. 44
    Abbott is shit stirring says:

  45. 45
    Mornington Crescent says:

    I’d say “…by 9.30 this evening” would be better.

  46. 46
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    Because he does not appear to have been a law abiding citizen

    Whether that means he should have been shot though, is debatable

  47. 47

    One would not regard Hogan-Howe as being from anywhere right of centre in his approach despite being billed as such.

    In fact, one would not regard David Cameron as such either.

  48. 48
    Tottenham Hotspot says:

    No! It was a murder innit! Coz ‘e was black!
    Burn everyfink! ‘Cept for Game coz we gonna get some PS4s innit!
    Racialist!

  49. 49
    The public says:

    I s it really going to be that hot?

  50. 50
    Abbott's Friends says:

  51. 51
    Bill Quango MP/5 says:

    Don’t even try and explain. She will never understand.

  52. 52
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    Trouble is Abbott doesn’t know any better, she is racist and bigoted.

  53. 53
    She's gone too far says:

    Is Abbott saying that the Jury is Corrupt?

  54. 54
    ??????? says:

    Jury found by majority 9 to 1 that HE did though …explain ?

  55. 55
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    Well who did and why?

  56. 56
    Casual Observer 5 says:

    Any which are in th EU.

    Vote UKIP.

  57. 57
    Non taxable Pikey says:

    About as much chance as being able to read an unexpurgated Chilcot.

  58. 58
    JH3094-0234-032 says:

    Strange, isn’t it.

    If a black man shoots a black man, they have little to say about it. They even lionise both parties. Respec’

    But if a white man shoots a black man, you get no end of fuss.

    Strange that.

  59. 59
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    Christ, if no one is gonna be accountable for shooting a guy on a tubetrain who never had a gun- what were they expecting

  60. 60
    Tin Hat Alert says:

    You know more than the Jury who sat through the WHOLE trial then?

  61. 61
    Casual Observer 5 says:

    With this guy, the correct vernacular is:

    He is a bit more crooked than straight.

    His political orientation is Common Purpose.

  62. 62
    JH3094-0234-032 says:

    Diane, the vast vast VAST majority of shootings in this country are black men shooting other black men. Check out the London crime map if you don’t believe me. Our cities would be incredibly safe were it not for such enrichment.

    How come you only make a fuss when the shooter is white?

  63. 63
    London, 2014 says:

  64. 64
    Blooming Godfrey says:

    I wonder if she’d rant on so much if Duggan had been white?

  65. 65
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    But they were unarmed. Oh hang on, just remembered – it doesn’t matter if they are unarmed just as long as the officer who shoots them says he thinks they were armed

  66. 66
    Pick litter for bennies says:

    Who will be the first politician to meet the Duggans?.Evens Vaz and Abbott,2-1 Dave and Mili,1000-1 Griffin.

  67. 67
    Dr Dre says:

    Great song.

  68. 68
    London Riots Part II: The Sequel says:

    Angry scenes outside Royal Courts of Justice as police give statement after Mark Duggan’s inquest

  69. 69
    will says:

    hey you seen smith.
    i do what i want and you may have seen me in a western.
    or then maybe.

  70. 70
    Gary Bloke says:

    Precisely, it was a jury and not a judge or a civil servant. From the row they were making after the verdict, the Duggan family and hangers-on sound bad losers.

  71. 71
    Another violent leftie says:

  72. 72
    Anonymous says:

    Well it is years since they had the last lot ! Just heard the morons on the news, give me fecking strength.

  73. 73
  74. 74
    Blooming Godfrey says:

    Idiot.

  75. 75
    Ban the Left says:

    Dave should go and hug them to make everything better, and perhaps enoble the parents.

  76. 76
    Blooming Godfrey says:

    10-1 they’ll be on Jeremy Kyle.

  77. 77
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    The judgement was no unanimous

  78. 78
    The LOLs continue says:

  79. 79
    A media student who ISN'T a leftie!!!! says:

  80. 80
    Ban the Left says:

    The next spin is that burning buildings in London are a clear indication of global warming…

  81. 81
  82. 82
    Twitter Twats out in force says:

    As usual there is not a shortage of idiots tweeting on the subject and making comments which are at the least very questionable and risk possible arrest/ prosecution for incitement.

    People obviously have very short memories or don’t read the newspapers

  83. 83
    Londoner says:

    They have had the debate. The jury has decided.

    It was lawful to kill him.

  84. 84
    Mornington Crescent says:

    To those of you who may have the misfortune to live in London, can I suggest you go to bed tonight with a pair of asbestos underpants and a fire extinguisher…?

  85. 85
    Keep Calm, Vote UKIP says:

    For strength – Vote UKIP.

  86. 86
    BHH says:

    We know where they live

  87. 87
    Brrrrrrap! says:

    I hope the jury get police protection. From the sounds of it, the Duggan family and their supporters behaved in a threatening manner after the verdict was returned.

  88. 88
    Brrrrrrap! says:

    You forget that the riots started in London and then spread across the country.

  89. 89
    M102 says:

    Lee Grasper getting his @rse handed to him on a plate on Sky News.

  90. 90
    tracers are set. says:

    follow russell crowe in the quick and dirty.
    switch horses….then hop on Gene hackman..
    he will lead to Will Smith, who is will.i.am and does what he wants.

    he will lead to the firm of russell reynolds who in turn will deliver the dean of the harvard business school.

  91. 91
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    The officer who shot him obviously needs moving back on to the beat

    Is there a limit on the number of people you can shoot because you honestly think they are holding a gun – when they aren’t?

  92. 92
    Anonymous says:

    Lammy smears the jury. Wants more money spent.

    “There are aspects of this verdict that are somewhat perplexing and seemingly contradictory to those of who us who have carefully followed the proceedings over the last few months. A number of serious questions remain unanswered”.

  93. 93
    Meanwhile, in a galaxy far far to the left says:

    Questions they ask, but others prompt they do :

  94. 94
    Marc de Nadiov says:

    I nominate Nick Clegg to meet Duggan’s Mum, Auntie and Bro in a dark alleyway.

  95. 95
    Casual Observer 5 says:

    How would disturbances in Manchester affect UKIP’s share of the vote in the upcoming by-election ?

  96. 96
    Roma of the dump says:

    Of course the media want a riot, they make excellent Television.

  97. 97
    Pick litter for bennies says:

    Weather Centre warning//heavy rain forecast in London,please avoid all unnecessary rioting.

  98. 98
    Teddy says:

    come back to bed Owen…..

  99. 99
    Warren Peace says:

    With all the cash Grasper has stolen off the taxpayer, you would think he’d get his effing teeth fixed.

  100. 100
    Ah! Monika says:

    Romanian migrant treated to Costa Coffee by Keith Vaz is accused of being a drug user who beat up his girlfriend and threatened to drown her

  101. 101
    History Boy says:

    It was looting, not riots. I doubt if many of the participants outside of Tottenham had ever heard of Duggan.

  102. 102
    Sunderland is a Labour ghetto thats why its shyte says:

    Lammy wouldnt dare say anything else,he knows what side his bread is buttered,as for Abbot I bet she is glad she had enough finances to send her son to a private school where he wouldnt have to mix with what Chukka would call chavs.

  103. 103
    Whippersnapper2 says:

    Is that THE Diane the big fat overweight racist cow? I think we should be told.

  104. 104
    They're all in it together says:

    Yep. Seen it myself.
    The senior civil servants statement to an investigator is deemed their personal info and asking for it is “flying in the face of the FOI Act.”
    Of course the judges are civil servants too…..

  105. 105
    Joined Up Thinking says:

    They are probably smart enough to realize that for a decent riot with lots of flames and safe looting you need a dry night.

    New Telly’s don’t like getting damp, and water damaged stolen goods sell for less than near perfect stolen goods.

  106. 106
    Not Blowing Whistles says:

    Not accused. There is a criminal record back in R’omania with his name and those charges on it, with other words like: Convicted.

  107. 107
    Romanian accordion player on London Underground says:

    Thank you please.

  108. 108
    Whippersnapper2 says:

    Probably, sooner or later.

  109. 109
    Guido Fawkes says:

    How can you not be armed and be lawfully killed? ! Defies belief.

  110. 110
    Tony B£air and the Renditioners says:

    Tough on drug dealers, tough on the causes of drug dealers.

    Have you forgotten already you fat fuckwit?

  111. 111
    Sunderland is a Labour ghetto thats why its shyte says:

    Duggan who was only 29 was the father of six to 3 different women no doubt the taxpayer will be busy in Tottenham over the next few years.

  112. 112
    Anonymous says:

  113. 113
    Sunderland is a Labour ghetto thats why its shyte says:

    Ed Milliband will be on shortly demanding a judge led inquiry and Vaz will nod oubt be down in Tottenham this evening for a foto op.

  114. 114
    Toxic Labour for Spongers, Parasites, Immigrants and Criminals says:

    The criminal scum should all face this type of summary justice!

  115. 115
    Point of Information says:

    Duggan who was only 29 when he was shot dead by police, had lived his entire adult life under a Labour government.

  116. 116
    Dr David K E L L Y says:

    Suicide ?

  117. 117
    The Union Jack says:

    Say black in me! Good evening.

  118. 118
    A Tottenham villain says:

    Can I have my sock back?

  119. 119
    Sunderland is a Labour ghetto thats why its shyte says:

    Balkan Udate…The twelve or so romanians Big Issue sellers and accordian players have now returned to their pitches in Tyneside and Wearside after a 10 day break,up the workers.

  120. 120
    10cc says:

    Load up
    Load up
    Load up
    with rubber bullets

  121. 121
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    I think he must have thrown the gun after he was dead if the police are to be believed, and who wouldn’t believe the police after plebgate?

    There is no way the police would close ranks to protect obe of their own if duggan had been unlawfully killed

  122. 122
    EU Watch says:

    EU migrants abusing benefits system is not a problem confined to UK, just largely ignored by the UK:

  123. 123
    Ω≈∂ß´√√ says:

    Memo to self… throw gun from Taxi….hm, check. Exit taxi in front of armed, nervous police with something held in hand… hm….Check… Bang!…..Bang!

    That seems to cover it. Why am I floating away?

  124. 124
    Sunderland is a Labour ghetto thats why its shyte says:

    Let us not forget PC Blakelock hacked down and murdered by decapitation on Broadwater Farm RIP

  125. 125
    Robbie Peel says:

    If plod had shot the first looter in the 5 minutes, there would have been no riots in London or anywhere else.

    First rule of looting, shoot the fuckers, and keep shooting until they stop.

  126. 126
    Tony B£air says:

    you never heard of Iraq, boy?

  127. 127
    EU Watch says:

    2000 police were deployed in Athens to enforce the protest ban imposed for the inauguration of Greece to take over the EU presidency.

    Far left party leader was attacked by the riot police:

    So, who exactly is the democratic authority in G’reece, or do they really not have one at present ? (Rhetorical question)

  128. 128
    Roma of the dump says:

    He should have been at home in Brazil with his family.

  129. 129
    NSA says:

    Remember the bad old days before Twitter when the brain’s prefrontal cortex used to get in the way of self-expression.

  130. 130
    Anonymous says:

    Or Lee Rigby

    run down then hacked to death by Afro moz with meat cleavers.

  131. 131
    EU Watch says:

    Looks like Cameron is winning friends in Poland, not:

  132. 132
    Anonymous says:

    and wet.

  133. 133
    Jim says:

    The puzzle here is that the evidence was changed after the ex hubby sent his email. That takes a lot of Credibility away from everybody involved. I always thought that signed statements used to bring/defend a case had to be stood by
    or changed in the body of the Court with a proper explanation rather than – Cor that is a good story, We agreed with Him!
    Was it something to do with extra legal fees or the publishing Rights?
    So many unanswered questions in English Law today.

  134. 134
    EU Watch says:

    Surprised the UK left isn’t raising the profile of this, admittedly just a little outside the EU:

    Protest has been going on for a few hours now outside the K’nesset.

  135. 135
    Anonymous says:

  136. 136
    Ricki's Uncle Bob says:

    She has a problem with her legs as well as her mouth – her legs won’t let her walk past a hot pie shop and her mouth won’t talk past a shit bandwagon.
    Bless.

  137. 137
    Boycott away says:

    Perhaps they could boycott coming here in the first place. That’ll learn us!

  138. 138
    Jim says:

    No, she is saying that the Verdict should have been restricted to only that part of the evidence. Whereas most normal people would want all the evidence included in the Verdict.

  139. 139
    Nigel's arsehole says:

    Yawn. No one cares. He was a scumbag and got what he deserved. Get over it

  140. 140
    Dave "Nasty" Cameron says:

    They burn pregnant women alive in Greece .

  141. 141
    Elsie Hargreaves 5 Railway Terrace Dewsbury says:

    That is disgusting.

    The morals of a tom cat.

    If he had behaved like that in China I dread to think what would have become of him.

    There is no Legal aid in China.

    I feel so sorry for those poor children tonight.

  142. 142
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    I care. I don’t want to live in a society where the police have a free pass to shoot who ever they want by just claiming they thought that someone was holding a gun

    Surely the police need better training in identifying the difference between someone holding a gun and someone not holding a gun

  143. 143
    Jim says:

    Just ignore the evidence and make up your own story.

  144. 144
    Cynic says:

    Yes…justified shooting of an armed drug dealing scumbag. Now will you come out say that and support the police?

  145. 145
    Bob Fleming says:

    just use live ammunition – might get the message and remind some of them of ‘home’

  146. 146
    Cynic says:

    Dear Baffled, Yet again you equivocate. No wonder your community is so beset by crime. You should celebrate this verdict. Go on. Dare you to.

  147. 147
    Cynic says:

    Why were these scum arrested for breach of the [peace?

  148. 148
    i don't n eed no doctor says:

    C4 News broadcasting live from Tottenham. That’s right C4 stir it up, lefts have some looting.

  149. 149
    ian says:

    the firearms officers said in evidence the only thing he was focusing on was the gun

    why was he focussing on somthing 20 feet away from where duggan was standing ?

  150. 150
    Cynic says:

    “My thoughts are with the family of Mark Duggan this evening.”

    ………..Not with the poor police officers threatened by him nor the children he and his friends sold drugs to

    “ the family will tonight feel that they are no closer to achieving justice for Mark”

    ……because the jury decided that he was an immediate threat to the lives of police officers and had to be shot.

    “the jury’s findings should be respected”

    …. Whoops…..As I am now trying to face two ways at the same time I almost fell over there

    “ The jury found that a number of key errors were made by Operation Trident and SOCA officers in the hours leading up to the shooting.”

    …and I will continue to grasp at these straws as a few may have votes attached to them

    “These questions must be answered not just for the sake of the Duggan family but to diffuse the confusion, conjecture and suspicion that continue to surround the events of that August evening. “

    ….ie buy off extremists and organised criminals using race as a cover for their criminality

    “The Duggan family’s sorrow and anger was palpable in court this afternoon “

    …….. as they must now answer their own questions about their role in bringing Mark up ino the criminal he became

    “ A number of serious questions remain unanswered.”

    Yada yada yada …. They jury heard the evidence but iu don’t want to admit the police were right to shoot him

    “It remains to be seen whether the IPCC will be well-placed to answer these questions.”

    …I am keeping my options open until I see how this plays ………

  151. 151
    Cynic says:

    …you get shot by the met

  152. 152
    David Cameron Is A Cunt says:

    Well seeing as how you are clearly a Hunt right now then being a Hero would be an improvement. But if you actually want to be one then it’s not IDS who needs shooting in the throat, not in a world that contains Cameron, Clegg, Cable, Millipede, Balls, Obama etc etc.

  153. 153
    ian says:

    and why did the police originally claim that duggan had fired first?

    something doesnt feel right about much of what those officers have claimed

  154. 154
    Father Preyer says:

    I know Owen ….girls are Scary aren’t they …now come and sit on my lap again and we will have one of our special chats

  155. 155
    Father Preyer says:

    Are the Militia on standby then?

  156. 156
    Psyche the Dog says:

    The joys of living Londonistan, I am glad I don’t live there

  157. 157
    Psyche the Dog says:

    What’s that, Hoggie How could not remember what he had written, he evidently been interviewed by some young desperate copper wanting promotion, he would be banged to rights in no time.

  158. 158
    FFS says:

    Let’s put it this way Fatbot. The jury. selected during commital proceedings where both sides were permitted to challenge the jurors to ensure they were fit to determine the outcome of the trial, that jury decided the killing was lawful. OK? Not for you, somebody not even at the trial, to question at all.

    So please FUCK OFF and SHUT UP before you cause any more problems,OK?

  159. 159
    Psyche the Dog says:

    There have been suggestions on this blog elsewhere that Fawkes is a naughty little boy, very libelous indeed.

  160. 160
    Reginald D Hunter says:

    That black bastard was letting down his brothers, and that fat black bit is supportin’ him.

    Shut the fuck up you fat ho.

  161. 161
    FFS says:

    Exactly, the carefully chosen jury (where both sides get to cross examine the jurors), and who were at the trial and not merely reading tit-bits in the press, decided it was lawful to kill him.

    Why are we even discussing this? Unless you want to call into question the whole issue of jury trials?

  162. 162
    FFS says:

    Um, no, because they knew (correctly) that Duggan had purchased a firearm and had it with him.

    Regardless of what he might have thrown anywhere in the dark, they had reason to believe he posed a real danger both to the police and others.

  163. 163
    Anonymous says:

    What a tit.

  164. 164
    FFS says:

    hopefully not….

  165. 165
    FFS says:

    Given that the jungle bunnies keep banging on about how persecuted they are…. we might as well persecute them, right?

  166. 166
    FFS says:

    By buying a firearm and carrying it with you, so that people might reasonably expect that you intend to use it at some point?

  167. 167
    FFS says:

    I’m not. At least their violent and criminal father won’t be having any further influence over their lives.

    Result.

  168. 168
    FFS says:

    They don’t. Duggan bought a gun and had it with him. How the hell were the police supposed to have known he threw it away in the dark?

    Jebus.

  169. 169

    BHH is a member. I have plenty of wood

  170. 170
    FFS says:

    If the jungle bunnies start behaving like jungle bunnies then we will probably be forced to come to the conclusion they really are just jungle bunnies.

    Let them get on with it.

  171. 171
    FFS says:

    Cos it was dark and he thought Duggan had a gun in his hand, which was reasonable since Duggan did have something in his hand and he had bought a gun and taken it with him in the taxi.

    Presumably Duggan threw the gun away to hide it from the police so he couldn’t be charged with a firearms offence. In that case we can assume he didn’t shout “cooeee rozzers, here’s my gun I’m throwing it away over there so you won’t be able to find it and charge me with firearms offences”. I presume he did it surreptitiously so the police had no idea he didn’t have it in his hand at the time they decided it was safest to shoot him.

    I would have done exactly the same in the police officers shoes. Nobody would have thanked me if Duggan had decided to keep hold of that gun and use it.

  172. 172
    FFS says:

    I don’t remember the police ever saying that, even when the events took place.

    But there you are, you have to rely on the jury hearing the whole story in great detail and not just what the papers say to make it all sound a lot more contraversial.

    Remember that Tony Martin that shot that lad in the back when he was running away from him? The papers tried to make that look much more a close thing than it was. Tony Martin was as guilt as sin. Putting a copper in the dock for making a 50/50 decision would be quite wrong.

  173. 173
  174. 174
  175. 175
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    The officer who shot him said he was holding a gun in a sock

    What happened to the sock?

    And if you were a firearms officer who unlawfully shot an unarmed man – wouldnt it always be a good idea to say that you believed he had a gun pointed at you?

    If these officers were watching his movements when he got out the taxi how come no one saw him throw the gun?

    Something doesnt quite stack up for me

  176. 176
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    It wasnt dark it was broad daylight

  177. 177
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    Twat

  178. 178
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    18.15 on the 4th of august would not have been dark

  179. 179
    Fishy says:

    What did we all do in a past life to have Owen Jones inflicted on us

  180. 180
    Jack Ketch says:

    This is common law and exists throughout the English speaking world. One may use all reasonable force to defend oneself. If one believes that one is in imminent danger of a lethal attack (i.e. your life is in danger), one may use all force necessary, including lethal force to prevent that assault.
    In Britain this sensible common law right has been chipped away by the courts and many an honest burgher has been prosecuted for whacking a burglar over the head with a golfclub, but in clear-cut cases common law has been upheld.
    The officer had confirmed information that Duggan was carrying a weapon and had carried weapons in the past. The officer challenged Duggan and believed that Duggan had pointed a weapon at him (the mobile phone). It is this belief that the court recognised that the officer was acting reasonably even if he was mistaken.
    One may remember those stupid Indians who tried to hold up an embassy in London with replica handguns, they were quite surprised when armed officers shot them down like dogs–or more accurately, stupid Indians pointing what looked like firearms.
    The killers of Lee Rigby were lucky that women armed officers confronted them–I would have emptied the whole magazine into their skulls, like those nice SAS men did to the Irish in Gib–remember those chaps BELIEVED that the Irish terrorists had a remote bomb switch with them–it’s all about honest belief.

  181. 181
    Jack Ketch says:

    Have you ever used a firearm? Have you ever been combat pistol trained? Have you ever had to face the problem of shooting before you are shot?
    When in a life threatening situation one has two-tenths of a second to make a decision and the lawyers have the rest of your life to hang you out to dry.
    The known gun-carrying drug dealer, Duggan acted in a manner giving the officer sufficient cause–maybe you would have preferred a dead plod?

  182. 182
    The Dead Dr says:

    I think you’ll find it was assisted suicide in your case sunshine!

  183. 183
    A normal white guy says:

    I don’t won’t to live in a society where a career crim drug dealer thinks he can carry a gun across London in order to shoot another drug dealer.

    Now f u c k. of and go and play with the traffic you lefty r e t ard

  184. 184
    An Actuary says:

    They shot the bloke, as planned. Then found the gun was in a sock inside the car. ‘What the fuck do we do now?’ Chuck it and pretend he threw it. Why not just stick it in his hand? Come off it, who would believe that?

  185. 185
    An Actuary says:

    ‘The lead investigator for the police watchdog inquiry into the fatal shooting of Mark Duggan in London was today forced to admit a “mistake” was made in the release of information that claimed he had fired at officers first.’

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2073268/Police-watchdog-admits-mistake-say-Mark-Duggan-shot-officers-ahead-English-riots.html

  186. 186
    Cato Street Conspirator says:

    I think it is generally understood that the filth lie their heads off, even when it isn’t necessary. It is the nature of people who go in for the job.

  187. 187
    I feared for my life says:

    so i shot im frough the ed seven times millord

  188. 188
    HEARDITALLSEENITALLBEFORE says:

    Guilty for ridding the world of filthy thieving gyppo scum ! He should have been knighted!

  189. 189
    JH3094-0234-032 says:

    Does it occur to anyone that were it not for black-on-black gun crime, we practically would not need armed police in the first place?

    http://www.murdermap.co.uk/murder-map.asp

    Filter to gun murders and observe the demographic involved. Who gets to riot about this again?

  190. 190
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    No but if I had been trained but could still not tell the difference between someone holding a gun and someone not holding a gun – then I might start to think I was in the wrong profession or that I should have gone to spec savers

    If the situation requires that the police in such situations avoid ever putting themselves in even the slightest danger – then duggan was as good as dead when he got in the taxi and was indeed executed

    If police policy in such circumstances is always to kill people like duggan rather than attempt to arrest them – then this policy should be made clear

    If you dont want to face the dangers associated with arresting people with illegal firearms then don’t join the police force

  191. 191
    nigels parachute in 2015 says:

    F u c k off

    You are probably like the rest of these right wing nutcases who thinks it was dark at 1815 in the middle of summer

  192. 192
    Displaced Brummie says:

    Hogan? How! Looks like a wrong ‘un.

  193. 193
    I feared for my life says:

    we are all looking forward to promotion

  194. 194
    Spartacus says:

    and what of the drachma?

  195. 195
    Anonymous says:

    ”he was a bad man” is much like the b-liar bush posture

    so he was killed and that’s all right – dont think so

  196. 196
    Anonymous says:

    like owning nuclear weapons?

  197. 197
    Anonymous says:

    twelve good men and true

  198. 198
    Anonymous says:

    for an election eight out of twelve – 67 percent would have been good

  199. 199
    Anonymous says:

    he should have been shot – same as nigella

  200. 200
    Mr Callaghan with the biggest weapon in the department says:

    In case it has escaped your notice, judges are appointed (mostly in secret) by other judges, all of whom come from the same ‘profession’. It is in all their interests to ensure that only the thickest amongst them ever get promoted to the Bench – which is why most courts are the province of the dimwads who really have no idea of what life is all about.

    Don’t want clever sods on the Benches undermining all the scams going on and fibs being told… This largely explains why we seem to be getting more and more perverse and totally unsuitable results and sentencing from them. Where is the present day Judge Jeffries? We need somebody to sort the current lot out pdq.

  201. 201
    Mr Callaghan with the biggest weapon in the department says:

    You ever heard of the Laughing Policeman??

    That used to be a joke 70 years ago, but these days it is these largely uneducated and out of control cvnts who are doing the laughing – at us. One of these days when the fat really does hit the fan, the police are going to have to decide just whose side they are on….

  202. 202
    Mr Callaghan with the biggest weapon in the department says:

    Some dickhead in the local council will probably impose a hosepipe ban on them…

  203. 203
    Mr Callaghan with the biggest weapon in the department says:

    …and exceptionally blinkered and THICK.

    HTF was she ever nominated to be an MP? The dregs of Acne?

  204. 204
    Mr Callaghan with the biggest weapon in the department says:

    Is he mates with Bojo perchance?

  205. 205
    (Not so)Dangerous Brian says:

    Twice!

  206. 206

    Did someone say cocks of living crisis?

  207. 207
    EyeSee says:

    The Duggan shooting comments and verdict are more to worry about. Once again armed police officers, unable to substantiate why they ‘had’ to open fire are exonerated. But our military, in a completely different scenario and actually under fire, in combat are relentlessly pursued and inappropriately imprisoned. What is going on? The police are clearly seen as a more direct tool of government and the need is to keep them on side. The army can go hang. I have looked at several IPCC reports of shootings and two things become clear. 1) the training and particularly the leadership of the armed police is inappropriate to the situations they are deployed to and of low quality and 2) the IPCC are there entirely and only to support the political view and certainly not to seek ways to improve standards.

  208. 208
    Optician says:

    He should have gone to Specsavers.

  209. 209
    True Grit says:

    Hear Hear! You live by the sword, you die by the sword…..

  210. 210
    Rightwinggit says:

    NP, you should have stopped at the word “no”

    I have been trained, and you haven’t got time to fill out a risk assessment form and take pictures, when the target presents itself, you fire.

    Better to be tried by twelve than carried by six.

  211. 211
    barrowboy says:

    White man’s burden Barrington-Smythe ole chum.

  212. 212
    barrowboy says:

    Do you think they have some Predators too ?

  213. 213
    big D says:

    Will the cops and Cameroon stop pandering to ” the community ” ie a few of the black residents of Tottenham and beyond please .
    Most people black and white must be heartily glad to see one member less of a notorious and vile gang.
    Its time to now round up the rest and put them out of harms way for a very long time for the safety of all inc the police.
    A job needed and required was done , end of story move on .
    The aunt and the rest of the baying mob inside and outside the court hurling abuse and threats at the jury as well as it seems destroying court property should have all been arrested and in front of the beak themselves this morning .
    Complete morons no doubt angry that they will now not be entiteled to com pen sation

  214. 214
    Arsehole watch says:

    Her comment just shows you how thick and pig ignorant of the law Abbott is.

  215. 215
    World of Sport says:

    Law abiding citizens 1 Gun carrying scumbag 0 . Result !

  216. 216
    Who gives says:

    Doesn’t have to be. The violent wee cun t is dead . Time to move on.

  217. 217
    Who gives says:

    Nigel its academic now your poster boy gangster is pan bread. Fuck him.

  218. 218
    To be read in a voice dripping in sarcasm says:

    Your right Nigel, the fact that he was a convicted drug dealer with a record of violence and known to carry guns was just coincidental to him being shot. It could have been anyone. If it hadnt been him it would have been the little old lady round the corner.

  219. 219
    To be read in a voice dripping in sarcasm says:

    Hardly surprising that Lammie finds aspects of this case surprising since he was clearly perplexed on celebrity mastermind.

  220. 220
    Johnny says says:

    I think the one that shot Duggan said he thought he saw a gun. It was another policeman that said the gun was in a sock.

  221. 221
    pc bollocks says:

    got what he deserved, fuck him abbott and chuka spear


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