January 24th, 2013

Dave Denies Debt Truth

PSND2

In all the referendum chatter yesterday something significant went little reported. Fraser Nelson pointed out that the Prime Minister told a massive fib in the Conservative party political broadcast. He claimed the government was “paying down Britain’s debts”, listen:

As you can see from the graph that is completely untrue. That’s not poor phrasing. That is lying.

UPDATE: Jean-Christophe Gray – the PM’s spokesman – told the Lobby that the PM does know the difference between the UK’s budget deficit, down from 11% to 7% of GDP and the total stock of debt, up from 70.7% to 79.9% by the time of the next general election.


78 Comments

  1. 1
    Jimmy says:

    “the Prime Minister told a massive fib”

    And this is your idea of news?

    • 3
      Ed Balls says:

      Isn’t that my job?

      • 8
        Plato says:

        I guess his argument is that they’re paying off some debt, whilst at the same time borrowing more.

        • 16
          Egg Card says:

          Yes we have a 0% transfer rate for you that will let you spread to costs of nationhood. Rates can change at any time especially when we sell out to BarclayCard

        • 24
          David says:

          No, I really don’t understand the difference between debt and deficit, just like Labour politicians. I only did arts at school followed by a PPE degree.

          • Ed Millibland says:

            Why is it red?

          • Civil Servants says:

            Just like us. We only employ generalists in senior roles.

          • nickleaton says:

            And Frazer Nelson doesn’t understand the difference between borrowing and debts.

            They have pensions debts.

            http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/dcp171766_263808.pdf

            In summary, the estimates in the new supplementary table indicate a total Government pension obligation, at the end of December 2010, of £5.01 trillion, or 342 per cent of GDP, of which around £4.7 trillion relates to unfunded obligations.

            Currently that’s up to 5,300 bn on top of the borrowing.

            Imagine. Going after Cameron for his lies, and lying in the process

      • 45
        Anonymous says:

        The Big Speech

        Dave, your long awaited speech
        Puts referendums out of reach
        We’ve not forgot the CAST IRON VOW
        And nobody believes you now
        So even if you makes it law
        No dice, we’ve heard it all before

        The Tory troops you try to muster
        All realise the speech is bluster
        Your hope to shoot the UKIP Fox
        Won’t surface in the ballot box
        Now UKIP’s got you on the ropes
        And blown away all Tory hopes

        We’re all fed up pissed off and grumpy
        Sick to death of Ange and Rumpy
        We do not want your EU flag
        To us it’s just a piece of rag
        We want our sovereignty back
        Our culture, laws and Union Jack

        • 58
          Living in 96.98 percent white Merseyside says:

          Oh beautiful bridge of the silvery Tay
          Alas I am very sorry to say
          etc.

    • 11
      Liam Byrne says:

      I did say there was no money left

    • 23
      Captian George Gideon Oliver Osborne says:

      Steady as she goes.

    • 62
      Fishy says:

      Of course he’s paying down our debts. If he wasn’t, the net debt would be even bigger.

  2. 2
    keredybretsa says:

    Playing down surely?

  3. 4
    Hugh Janus says:

    He’s a politician (and not even a very good one) and his lips were moving. Ergo, he was lying.

    Next subject: The Bleedin’ Obvious?

  4. 5
    Britain says:

    MY debt? Nobody asked me?

  5. 6
    Ah! Monika 2013 +1 says:

    Imagine a stack of crisp, new £20 notes in front of you.
    A one thousand pound stack would be only 5 millimetres high.
    A one million pound stack would be over 5 metres high, about the height of an average two-storey house.
    A one billion pound stack would be 3.5 miles high.
    A one trillion pound stack would be 3,500 miles high. If laid on its side, it would stretch from London to New York.

  6. 7
    Politician Watch says:

    There is nothing to say that politicians cannot lie, they just have to be honest in the house.

    More astonishing is the fact that the opposition did not pick up on this.

    Could have saved Milliband a chunk of his electorate.

  7. 9
    The lips, they move, they lie says:

    The bunch of bastards are all the same

  8. 10
    Margaret Hodge MP says:

    If I appoint a fucking manager I expect him to manage and not fanny about making fucking speeches about what he is going to do or not going to do in fucking ten years time.

    I dont give a toss too what school he went to or how much money he has got in the fucking Bank: if he works for me he pulls his finger out of his arse and gets results.

    I trust Cameron has now got the message.

  9. 12
    Oy Vey says:

    Never understood why Miliband doesn’t use this obvious ammo….

    In other news, the Doris that RoadKill t-shirts advery – holy cow…..

  10. 13
    sadbutmadlad says:

    Does the chart take into account inflation?

  11. 14
    Economist says:

    Do those figures include the QE ?

    Would be interesting to see the adjustment subtracting the money the UK has lent to itself.

  12. 18
    Give Me Free Money I am Bulgarian says:

    He’ll need to borrow more once we turn up!

    • 25
      A Romanian says:

      Me too!

    • 26
      Jimmy says:

      Give Butch his due. The last wave of Eastern European immigration was attracted by plentiful employment opportunities in a booming economy. It would be churlish to deny the government’s success in addressing this issue.

  13. 19
    Hors catégorie says:

    Zut alors, this is a bigger profile than the Mont Ventoux

  14. 28
  15. 29
    Ruling Elite says:

    I sent a quid in, hasn’t that sorted it yet?

  16. 33
    The Mystical Magical Money Tree says:

    Keep in the dark and feed plenty of bullshit

  17. 35
    Engineer says:

    Well that’s taken long enough. Plenty of senior politicians have been muddling ‘deficit’ and ‘debt’ since 2008, sometimes, quite possibly, deliberately; how come no journalist has noticed before?

    • 71
      T'old Fella says:

      Probably the same reason that folks do not know the difference between turnover and profit.

  18. 36
    Nothing Better To Do says:

    WAIT, you mean Cameron is a liar?

    Oh my God, maybe he’s lying about other stuff too?

    Like a referendum perhaps?

  19. 37
    Simon Cawkwell says:

    Bit of a long short, I know. But could not Dave defend himself by declaring that Britain is paying debts as and when they fall due even if Britain is taking on more debts to achieve this result?

    This is of course misrepresentation bordering upon deception. But it would not count as lying.

  20. 39
  21. 41
    Synic says:

    Dave is a fucking liar

  22. 43
    Ex-Tory says:

    Richard Littlejohn’s basic conversion to a family budget shows the true horror of the State finances:

    UK tax revenues £550,600,000,000
    Spending £694,890,000,000
    New borrowing £117,500,000,000
    Outstanding debt £1,312,100,000,000
    Spending cuts £11,000,000,000

    Now take off seven zeros and pretend it’s a household budget.

    Annual family income £55,060
    Annual family spending £69,489
    New debt on credit card £11,750
    Outstanding credit card balance £131,210
    Family spending cuts £1,100

  23. 50
    Shanghai Wheelbarrow Company says:

    We sell you cheap wheelbarrow so you can carry home wages. Top quality, made in China.

  24. 55
    Stavros says:

    - All quangos to reduce overheads and headcount by one third
    - 20% savings across local government
    - Fire the bottom 10% underperformers in the civil service for incompetence
    - Nobody in local government can earn more than the PM
    - Stop all pilgrims tomorrow
    - Make public sector shirkers work longer hours
    - No cushy early retirement for public servants

    There, I’ve flushed billions of few savings in 20 seconds

  25. 57
    Popeye says:

    He opened his mouth, why not presume he’s lying?

  26. 60
    Anonymous says:

  27. 63
    Anonymous says:

    Adding to the suggestions for savings (No 55 above) :

    Abolish the DfID altogether.

    Ditto the Ministry for Culture, Media and Sport, and any government or local government department with the words Climate Change or Equality in its title.

    Close down the London Assembly and sell off the building. The London Mayoralty to be terminated when the current Mayor’s term expires.

    Any useful functions from the above to be returned to the traditional ministries, e.g. the Home Office or the Ministry of Works.

    Abolish the Supreme Court, sell the building, and bring back the Law Lords.

    Sell off the BBC, and use the proceeds to pay down the National Debt.

  28. 64
    Yawn! says:

    Devious by delusional Dave strikes again! Does he really think he can get away with such whoppers and no one will notice?

  29. 65
    Jim says:

    This can only happen by poor Media reporting. A labour spokesperson was allowed to say that the increase in borrowing was because the Tories had increased Welfare payments. Nothing to do with pre 2010 signed contracts and no attempt to balance reporting. It is what the media wish to Broadcast and not the truth that matters. They always need another story for tomorrow, that is why the I of FS do so many reports on the same subject. The Media choose which one suits their story.

  30. 69
    (I've been renamed) DA-Notice says:

    ..and the next great deception will be nominal GDP targeting.

    In the debt to GDP ratio GDP is the numerator so if they (Mark Carney and the Dept. of Debt, formerly the Treasury) target GDP to increase it the ratio either goes down or rises at a slower rate depending on what the nation’s debt burden does but it will appear to be not as much of a problem as before even though it may still be rising at the same rate because we still have a budget deficit.

  31. 74
    Mike Newland says:

    ‘This time is different’. Government can go on borrowing money forever!

  32. 75
    LL says:

    “This can only happen by poor Media reporting. ”

    Uh? Did you listened to an himself saying it?

  33. 77
    hey ho says:

    john redwoods blog has been pointing this out for some time

  34. 78
    Moggsy says:

    Massive fib… Well did you see his lips move? What did you expect then?


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Rod Liddle on the loony UN sexism special rapporteur:

“There is more sexism in Britain than in any other country in the world, according to a mad woman who has been sent here by the United Nations.

Rashida Manjoo is a part-time professor of law at Cape Town University in the totally non-sexist country of South Africa (otherwise known as Rape Capital Of The World).

Mrs Magoo has been wandering around with her notebook and is appalled by the sexist “boys’ club” culture here, apparently.

I don’t doubt we still have sexism in the UK. But is it worse than in, say, Saudi Arabia, d’you think, honey-lamb? Or about 175 other countries? Get a grip, you doolally old bat.”



orkneylad says:

What’s he been doing FFS, mining bitcoins?


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