April 5th, 2012

Ken is the 14.5%
Former Climate Change Adviser Knocked Up Partial Figures

Last night Ken promised on Newsnight to publish his accounts. He further said this morning “I will set out income to my company over the last four years, how much my wife and I received and how much tax was paid.” Instead we got a partial view of what he decided to pay tax on. Ken also claims that an accountant has signed these figures off, yet provides no evidence for this unlike the other candidates.  He has still not published his company accounts and the clock is ticking

Guido’s been speaking to bean counters today who are slightly puzzled by what Ken has put out. One writes:

“a)      no book-keeper, let alone an accountant, has been near this – you never date down the left hand side – you run left to right;

b)      Corporation Tax is paid on profits, not dividends – massive f**k-up here – tells you all you need to know about the integrity of these accounts.”

The meta-data on the .PDF document shows that it was drawn up not by an accountant, but by Mark Watts- Ken’s old Climate Change Adviser at City Hall. He got one of the crony pay-offs in 2008. 

Apart from the 14.5% effective income tax rate – which Matthew Hancock points out is less than a City Hall cleaner pays – the main take-away from the part-publication is that by paying himself in dividends he is avoiding paying National Insurance, which employees have to pay. If you are employed you pay it at 12%. If you are self employed you pay it at 9%. If you are Ken, you don’t pay it at all. 

He cannot say he is paying his fair share when he is avoiding paying National Insurance, which is the tax that pays towards the NHS. The question for Ken is a simple one. Why are you paying yourself in dividends rather than salary? There is only one answer. To avoid tax.

Boris’ figures have the accountants signature on them and Paddick has put his actual returns, plus a few personal details, out. Why so dodgy Ken?


367 Comments

  1. 1
    Ken's Krusty Krackers says:

    Yup. Selective accountancy, methinks!

  2. 2
    Init says:

    Well be ing invovled with one type of fraud (climate change) makes him qualified to sort out Kens accounts

  3. 3
    Ken Livingstone says:

    erm…because I’m an untrustworthy slimeball?

  4. 4
    Tony Bliar didnt fool me says:

    (hand up in the air) oh Guido oh Guido I know the answer……

  5. 5
    Bon says:

    They left the metadata in the pdf?!

    ROFL!!! Oh this has been the funniest day in a long time

  6. 6
    Anonymous says:

    Why so dodgy, ken?

    Because he’s a scheming old hypocrite who believes he can pull the wool over people’s eyes. My, how he must be so envious of Gorgeous George and his safe seat in Blackburn/Bradford, wherever…….

  7. 7
    meme says:

    someone says over 65’s dont pay NI – and ken over 65 … ! guido !!!!! check yur facts.

    Real question for next debate

    Boris – you paid the 50% tax rate on your income, and campained to remove it.

    Ken – you avoiding paying the 50% tax rate on your income, and campained to keep it – why try to keep a tax you were unwilling to pay ?

  8. 8
    grobdj says:

    Unfortunately for Ken, the climate has changed

  9. 9
    Keith Battye says:

    Bang on there Boyo.

  10. 10
    Aaron D Highside says:

    A work of genius, Guido! I expect the BBC to give you some sort of investigative journalism award.

  11. 11
    Sunny Hundal says:

    Under credulous in the dictionary now there is a picture of me.

  12. 12
    Sack Cameron - Elect A Tory says:

    Quick! Fetch Anonymous! Urgent Engagement Required!!!

  13. 13
    pisdon says:

    National Insurance shouldn’t be an issue as he is over 65???

  14. 14
    RedKen says:

    Tax is for the little people not champagne socialists like me.

  15. 15
    The Guardian says:

    The real story is Boris Johnson is rich while Ken scrapes by on £5,000 a year. Vote for Ken. Please vote for Ken. Someone…

  16. 16
    Samantha Brick says:

    Anthropogenic global warming is as real and undeniable as my beauty

  17. 17
    Liarpoliticians says:

    We should do away with scams…… like Ken Livingslime.

  18. 18
    Ken's Krusty Krackers says:

    The problem is Ken believes he is unaccountable for everything and it is his human right to be as dodgy as he likes.

  19. 19
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    The arrogant idiots, a gift that just keeps on giving.

  20. 20
    Word says:

    If only the entirety of London were blog reading, newsnight watching politicos. Then perhaps this might make a difference.

    Best part is, I think Ken knows it. Hence, he doesn’t really care what the “right wing blogosphere” thinks.

    Risky game, Ken. Wonder if it’ll pay off?

  21. 21
    Anonymous says:

    “which is the tax that pays towards the NHS”

    no it isn’t.

    It goes into the big pot like everything else

  22. 22
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    Yes , apparently the Newt isn’t rich , he just has a life style.

    That is the cry of every salaryman.

  23. 23
    Sarah - a London nurse. says:

    We knew he was a hypocrit, even if he is “our” hypocrit – but denying the NHS National Insurance contributions is a new low.

    Ed Miliband MUST come out & denounce this tonight.

  24. 24
    Backwoodsman says:

    The other real story is how a part time copper like Paddick ends up with a £65,000 a year public sector pension – What would it take to get that in the real world !!!!

  25. 25
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    *blurgh*

    for when you feel hot . . .

    http://wattsupwiththat.com/reference-pages/sea-ice-page/

  26. 26
    Ed Balls fisted my hamster says:

    Still all quiet on the BBC & Sky…

  27. 27
    Fred West Paving Ltd says:

    Go on! Finish him!!!

  28. 28
    A Jealous Woman says:

    Ha Ha – funniest comment i’ve read on here for ages

  29. 29
    WVM says:

    He’s red and that’s all I or anyone else needs to know.

  30. 30
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    You may well be correct but even the poor, thick, bigoted and unthinking can recognize a crooked prick when they see one and unless Ken promises to give them a pile of someone else’s stuff. Oh, hang on . . .

  31. 31
    Dianne Abbotts thong says:

    65K a year public sector bung? You’d need to be a Muslim terrorist living on benefits to get that here.

  32. 32
    JH says:

    What, the one with the hole in the bottom?

  33. 33
    BBC News says:

    Vote Labour!

  34. 34
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    Common purpose anyone?

  35. 35
    Drop a daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    The BBC of course getting all upset over some fucking rag head mong wanted in the USA.

    How come whitey can be sent to America for trial and the BBC says nothing, yet some rag head twat is up for it and the BBC gets all wet eyed?

  36. 36
    Drop a daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    BBC are going over a rag head and Sky hacking the email of a criminal.

  37. 37
    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery! says:

    I think I just heard the wheels coming off Ken’s election battle bus…. The “big mo'” as Americans call winning electoral impetus has happened for him..only in the wrong direction.

  38. 38
    It is not a tax return then? says:

    The senior Conservative today published an accountant’s letter showing he earned £1.7 million over the four years to April 2011 – and paid 40 per cent in income tax and national insurance.

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/conservative/9188663/Boris-Johnson-and-Ken-Livingstone-release-personal-tax-details.html

  39. 39
    meme says:

    Boris earns £450K but pays £200k in tax, thats a lot of pensions, nurses and teachers, and EMA for those than need it.

    Ken avoided the 50% rate – thats a lot of poorer pensioners, and more unemployed, no ema and rioters…… and more cuts.

  40. 40
  41. 41
    Anonymous says:

    How many of you trust accountant’s letter? As far as I can see even an estate agent will not let a property based on this letter.

    But Boris wants us to believe it.

  42. 42
    Sigmund Freud says:

    Too much bed wetting and Liberal naval gazing.

  43. 43
    AC1 says:

    A bit like a 7 layer “scan” of a certain presidents Birth cert?

  44. 44
    Anonymous says:

    London doesn’t give a fuck about what do you think.

  45. 45
    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery! says:

    Hello Anonymous… Then why should we trust you?

  46. 46
    AC1 says:

    KenGate?

  47. 47
    WVM says:

    Indeed Angela, everyone needs to hurry before they all commit suicide.

  48. 48
    I Remember You Hoo says:

    Truly pathetic anonymong. You are getting more idiotic by the hour. How do you do it?

  49. 49
    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery! says:

    And little old you speaks for London?

  50. 50
    Pallasathene says:

    Only since June 2010.

  51. 51
    The only politician who never took Murdoch's shilling says:

    While Guido obsesses with his favourite dead horse

    Are there no arrest warrants out for the Murdochs yet ?

  52. 52
    Anonymous says:

    Boris didn’t pay national insurance its 13.8% not 0.75%. Why does even someone on £40,000 pays 13.8% but Boris on £400,000 pays only 0.75%?

  53. 53
    JH says:

    You have to pity them.

    Can you imagine them all running about, yelling into phones, shrieking orders, all the while frantically manoeuvring to avoid being held responsible for this omnishambles?

    ‘The Thick Of It’ probably didn’t come close.

  54. 54
    Russian Oligarch and his bent City solicitors says:

    Only a question of time and of how bent the Director of Public Prosecutions has become…

  55. 55
    I Squiggle says:

    Who’s in that hole over there and keeps on digging? Ah, Mr Livingstone, I presume..

  56. 56
    Anonymous says:

    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery!; I am not running for any public office so there is no need for you or anyone else to trust me. But Boris is running for public office.

  57. 57
    Joss Taskin says:

    Can’t we just get Jeremy Vyle to do a lie detector test on the sleaze bag ??

  58. 58
    I Squiggle says:

    Also..

    My thirty years living in London have taught me one thing: When Ken Livingstone is in public office, he thinks he’s unaccountable. When he’s not, he still is..

  59. 59
    JH says:

    An 8 point drop in his ratings last week might be an indicator of that strategy’s success.

    This little uproar won’t help either – the BBC can be as deafeningly silent as it likes.

  60. 60
    I Remember You Hoo says:

    The local Muhfti re-named it New Hyderabad, so the locals can feel a little more at home.

  61. 61
    Mark Oaten says:

    Greece was just the fart before the turd, Spain is about to go plop plop!

    http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/debt-crisis-live/9187339/Debt-crisis-Live.html

  62. 62
    Polly Twitwaddle says:

    What is the duty on Champagne these days?

  63. 63
    I Remember You Hoo says:

    Miliband is too busy looking out for his next bandwagon to bother with Ken. After all his own families tax dodging past may come back to bite him too.

  64. 64
    Red Ken Lyingscum says:

    Be (c) lucky ! I’m an accomplished Liebour liar. I’ve had decades of practise telling porkies.

  65. 65
    Professor Phil Jones (UEA) says:

    Allow me to er, ‘audit’ those accounts.

  66. 66
    annette curton says:

    Re-advertised due to time waster, no tyre kickers.

  67. 67
    David B says:

    The question on the “Corporation Tax on Dividends”. Is this the tax paid by the company at source? If it is then Ken did not actually pay this tax. Just look at a dividen slip from any share’s you might hold. The tax is deducted at source, but your end of year tax bill is reduced by that amount.

    It looks like this tax paid on dividends has been double counted in the figures

  68. 68
    MrAngry61 says:

    Even if RedKen’s > 65, his company would still be obliged to pay employer’s C1 NIC contributions on any salary in excess of ?£5720.

  69. 69
    You couldn't make it up! says:

    The BBC has started a new debate show on BBC3 to brainwash the 16 to 24 year olds called “Free Speech” with Owen Jones as a panellist!

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/i/b01fkcmn/

  70. 70
    Bloody Hell says:

    It’s worse than that.
    They are simply saying that BoJo has published and then give the figures for him.
    No mention that Paddick and that tramp from the Greens have published also.

    No mention that the whole things is because of Ken’s hypocritical brayings.

  71. 71
    I Remember You Hoo says:

    Shhh, the globalist socialist ‘charity’ does only good and pious work. In total secrecy of course, as do all charities.

  72. 72
    rick says:

    Isn’t this how they finally nailed Capone – on a tax fiddle ?

  73. 73
    annette curton says:

    Tyre.

  74. 74
    Tony Bliar didnt fool me says:

    Thinking of poping down the bookies to place a bet on RedKen doing the honourable thing, or should I just keep my money in my pocket ?…….its a difficult one….

  75. 75
    Anonymous says:

    Over 65s don’t pay national insurance and national insurance is 13.8% not 0.75% as Boris is paying.

  76. 76
    Gooey Blob says:

    If you want Miliband to denounce Livingstone, you’ll have to go through Len McCluskey. The dummy won’t speak without the ventriloquist’s consent.

  77. 77
    Wat Tyler says:

    What about his wife / partner? How old is she, how many shares does she own and what NI does she pay on the dividend? (Hint: None)

    Not to mention her tax-free allowance and lower tax rate than if Ken had taken the money.

    And why are political staffers paid out of “pre” tax income?

  78. 78
    Anonymous says:

    What about the once paying Boris, do they pay employer NI?

    Also how come Boris pay 0.75% national insurance when the rate is 13.8% for others?

  79. 79
    Who knows? says:

    Ken was heckled in Walthamstow high Street about his taxes a few days ago.

  80. 80
    annette curton says:

    Lol, link to free speech website, now that would be a turn up for the books (1984).

  81. 81
    BBC 2 says:

    Unless you want abortion on demand

  82. 82
    Anonymous says:

    There’s an upper limit for NI contributions, which is why those with very high incomes don’t pay much NI as a proportion. It used to be completely capped, but Labour changed it to 1% above the cap (rather than 0%, as previously).

  83. 83

    http://twitpic.com/95k6gk – Ken the “Jammie Tax Dodger” Picture

  84. 84
    Anonymous says:

    Though of course you can employ people overseas and not pay any C1 NICs. It’s actually more expensive to employ a pensioner than it is to pay someone in another country…

  85. 85
    Anonymous says:

    No, it doesn’t. The NI fund is ring-fenced. Though Gordon et al. may well have borrowed from it (in which case the government has to pay it back at some point).

    Of course, it’s all a bit of a lie anyway.

  86. 86
    Douglas Adams says:

    Ken “proves” he paid the same tax as Boris, and for an encore goes on to prove that black is white and gets himself killed on the next zebra crossing.

  87. 87
    Thatguyoverthere says:

    Hey Phil, me and Mike are off to Yamal for a few weeks. Wanna come?

  88. 88
    BBCwatch says:

    Could the first guest be a certain mayoral candidate who also doesn’t know the difference between wealth and income?

  89. 89
    annette curton says:

    Rich Tease.

  90. 90
    Anonymous says:

    No. The reason that is there is that CT has been paid on the company’s profits. It was, of course, paid by his company, not directly by Ken, but it’s a relevant figure if you’re trying to compare a sole trader (like Mr. Paddick) with someone operating a company (like Ken). Put another way, while Ken doesn’t pay NI on his dividends, the profits from his company *are* subject to Corporation Tax, and it is from that *taxed* money that he is paying himself dividend, which is then subject to Income Tax as well.

  91. 91
    annette curton says:

    I bet he can’t sing either (well not until his bollocks drop).

  92. 92
    Golly says:

    Only little people pay taxes.

  93. 93
    London is not stupid says:

    To Anonymous:

    London needs to ask itself this question: can we rely on Ken’s promises?

    Tax avoiding rich bastard Ken says “tax avoiding rich bastards just don’t get it”.

    How easily can someone like that wriggle out of freezing rail fares? Pretty easily one would think. Perhaps Londoners are giving this due consideration.

  94. 94
    Anonymous says:

    Agreed. That’d be a £2m+ pension pot, easy, in the private sector.

  95. 95

    Phrase for the day.

    “Beyond our ken”

    Meaning – Beyond our understanding.

    Origin – unfathomable tax semi-explanation put forward by a former mayor of London.

    See also – Ken, noun – Scots northern English dialect.

    beyond someone’s ken: beyond the knowledge of, beyond the comprehension of, beyond the understanding of, beyond the acquaintance of, beyond the awareness of, beyond the cognizance of beyond the ken of the average layman

  96. 96
    I Remember You Hoo says:

    It was set up bent in the first place. Know your history.

  97. 97
    Never gonna happen despite all the show-boating says:

    I wouldn’t count on them being subject to any charges whatsoever in the UK Courts AND even if I’m wrong one things for sure the USA doesn’t extradite US (naturalised or not)citizens to the UK as easily as the UK extradites UK born citizens to USA……

  98. 98
    Synic says:

    When Ken is finally skewered, which corrupt tax-avoiding politician shall we pursue next ? — how about Bliar — Ken will look like small fry. Then there’s about another 600 or so in the HoC, or would the HoL fraudsters have screwed the ordinary taxpayers for even more in total. The thieves are experts at ignoring the laws that they enact to control the ordinary serfs.

  99. 99
    BBC awards committee says:

    There is no investigative journalism award. There is no Boris or Ken. This event never happened. Everything new! Everything Clean! Must erase must erase!

  100. 100
    The Grauniad says:

    And the three little pigs was because of evil bankers

  101. 101

    All this media attention. He’ll be in the 50% tax bracket soon.

  102. 102
    David B says:

    Almost, but not quite. When the taxed profits are distributed the shareholder will get a credit for the tax paid by the company, which he will then deducte from his actual income tax bill. Therefore the CT paid by the company is double counting

  103. 103
    North of Watford Gap Services says:

    Is there some sort of election taking place in London then??

  104. 104
    Anonymous says:

    How ever you put it, do you think someone on £400,000 will only pay £3,000 NI? £250 a month, just look at your payslip.

  105. 105

    From White Van European wines and spirits, astonishingly little.

  106. 106
    Ed Moribund says:

    Hello – Alistair Campbell? look…We have a problem and I think only you can help.
    You’re going to need all your ‘private’ files.

    I want you to save him if you can.
    Burn him if you can’t.

  107. 107

    Gordon never borrowed anything. He invested it.

  108. 108
    Angela Merkel says:

    If you buy Greece, don’t leave it out overnight – you might find a German towel on it the next morning…

  109. 109
    Biased BBC says:

    We are telling everyone how much tax Ken paid – but not how much he earned.

  110. 110
    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery says:

    Your bloody right there Anonymous I don’t trust you! How much are Unite paying you to try defend the failing Ken?

  111. 111
    MandyPickleSniffer says:

    Is there no end to Ken’s Huntitude?

  112. 112
    Anonymous says:

    She’s under 65, she owns one of only two shares in VATLIES Ltd and takes the same dividend as Ken. Straight to the joint account.

  113. 113
    Maximus says:

    You have defined infantilism, not socialism. In socialism, the end justifies the means.

  114. 114
    Anonymous says:

    London is not stupid says:; you are right London is not stupid, just check number of MPs it elect from each party.

  115. 115
    annette curton says:

    Ideological dilemma?.

  116. 116
    A Ball of Slime says:

    I resent the way people keep making comparisons between me and nasty bent politicians like Ken Livingstone

  117. 117
    Mi8 never late says:

    labour …filth ….just filth

  118. 118
    annette curton says:

    Me thinks not on reflection.

  119. 119
    Peter Mandelbum says:

    Its more of a stress test to see how well the post office can deliver mail in bulk in time to be sold off.

  120. 120
    Jimmy says:

    Double counting is the wrong term. Dividend income is taxed at a lower rate than normal to reflect the notion that it has already been taxed in the company’s hands as profit. Where Ken has massaged the numbers is in counting that notional tax as tax paid but only counting the net figure in his income rather than the notional gross income in represents. In other words you either put the gross figure on both sides of the equation or neither. This means his 37% is just as nonsensical as Guido’s 14.5% albeit for different reasons. A like for like calculation would produce a similar figure to Paddick’s

  121. 121

    What a F*cking turn up for the books? The Conservative Toff pays his taxes in full and the Champagne Socialist dodges his – who’d have thunk it?

  122. 122
    smoggie says:

    Poor old Ken….. feeding the hand that bites him !

  123. 123
    Compliance first intolerance later says:

    Maximus: you mean the promised end justifies the means. The real end involves megadeaths.

    And I don’t mean the rock band.

  124. 124
    Legal beagle says:

    Aned so the evidence of criminality throughout the Murdoch empire accumulates

    http://www.guardian.co.uk/media/2012/apr/05/sky-news-hacking-emails-canoe-man

  125. 125
    14.5% not a penny more not a penny less says:

    National Insurance is a tax and by paying himself and his missus in dividends instead of income he avoids it – both employer’s and employees’ contributions.

    kerching!!!!!!!!!!

  126. 126
    Jack says:

    And I s r a e l i citizens cannot be extradited at all from their country !!

    Look at Meyer Lansky and many oligarchs …

  127. 127
    Sarah Tweet says:

    Keep spinning please! It would be so awful if Ken didn’t win.
    I love it when the nights get lighter. So very lovely.

  128. 128
    Jimmy says:

    And what do you believe the current NI rate is for 65 year old employees?

    No conferring.

  129. 129
    Twat Galloway says:

    Looks like Ken is fucked.

    Is it too late for me to stand, for the Raving Jihadi Postal Vote party?

  130. 130
    Radio four says:

    This week on MoneyBollox, how to avoid national insurance and save yourself a tidy sum.

    It’s perfectly legal. But best not to accuse others of avoiding taxes if you’re planning on doing this. Glass houses and all tha.

  131. 131
    Jimmy says:

    “If you are Ken, you don’t pay it at all. ”

    If you’re 65 you don’t pay it at all.

    Are these accountants of yours the same one you used before?

  132. 132
    14.5% not a penny more not a penny less says:

    Who cares? We wanna know about Ken’s £19,000 donation to the Labour Party through his company and was it claimed as a tax deductibe expense?

    Is Ken allergic to paying his fair share of tax or what ????

  133. 133
    14.5% not a penny more not a penny less says:

    Ermm….this tax avoidance predates June 2010 when he collected his free bus pass.

    Back in your court, pal.

  134. 134
    Radio For Guardianistas says:

    Followed by the Gay Archers, set in the quiet countryside village of multiculturalistan.

  135. 135
    Bbc One says:

    Tonight on question Time, Brian Pillock, hippy mayoral hopeful, but quite a nice guy anyway. Boris Johnson, philander and toff. Mayor of London (not for long hopefully).
    Jenny Jones, some primary teacher we think. Very well intentioned if a wringing wet liberal, and Ken Livingstone, tax avoider and hypacryt.

    Oh, sadly Question is not on tonight. Here’s a program about a person who can sing well, and omeone who can’t. You choose which one you prefer (you pathetic saps)

  136. 136

    It seems that if Ken had been discovered breaking into old ladies’ flats, stealing their pension books and converting them to his own benefit then Anonymous would still be defending him.

    Rule A: You can’t argue with a socialist.

  137. 137
    Sir Aston Martin says:

    >omnishambles

    “Clusterfuck” would be my word-choice there.

  138. 138
    Jimmy says:

    So a couple of grand then. Earth shattering stuff.

  139. 139
    I Hate Tesco AND the Pope says:

    Of course – you’d know, wouldn’t you, you drivelling fuckwit?

  140. 140
    Anonymous says:

    Lord Kinnock of Wind-Baggery says:; are you mad? I never asked you to trust me, you say you don’t as well.

    Then you ask me how much unite pays me. I will tell you a lie (hope you aren’t stupid enough to believe), they pay me £1,000,000,000,000,000 for each word.

  141. 141
    Radio Four says:

    Women’s Hour. With Owen Jones. As a gay, outraged liberal Marxist , he can scream shrilled than anyone

  142. 142
    Sir Aston Martin says:

    No, the one that’s made out of wide-mesh netting.

  143. 143
    Peter Grimes says:

    Fuckwit ZaNuLieBor troll, do piss off, your orchestrated campaign cuts no ice here.

  144. 144
    14.5% not a penny more not a penny less says:

    I’d like to know how many grand does it take for him to become a taxdodger and a hypocrite.

    Take your time, Jimmy…

    You may phone a friend.

  145. 145
    Bill Quango MP says:

    Anon would accuse Jenny Jones of being against environmentalism if it would gain old Ken a vote.

  146. 146
    Postal Votes says:

    Nope! We ain’t stupid – we are VERY well organised…

  147. 147
    Tower Hamletian says:

    Not interested Bro.

    We are working overtime here, printing ballot papers with our John Bull printing set.

    Our hero Ken will prevail, returned by 120% of the electorate.

  148. 148
    Anonymous says:

    Tony Bliar didnt fool me says:; I will not be surprise if Blair is a non dom or like Ashcroft doesn’t pay much taxes in UK as most of his income are received in other countries.

  149. 149
    Peter Grimes says:

    There are still a few real Brits in Walthamstow then!

    It’s the incomers who will fall for Livingslime!

  150. 150
    Ctesibius says:

    Actually that’s how it’s always been in the real world.

  151. 151
    Sack Cameron - Elect A Tory says:

    are you a perchance a Pilgrim, NonyMong?

  152. 152
    Radio Four says:

    And now, You and Y

    *CLICK!*

  153. 153
    Peter Grimes says:

    Fuckwit ZaNuLieBor troll peddling the lies from the prompt sheet again!

    Do fuck off and try to con some of those who might believe you.

  154. 154
    Anonymous says:

    meme says:; you might be also able to say he pays more than Ashcroft or Green.

  155. 155
    Professor Owen Jones (BBC) says:

    Yep, I’m good with numbers, I’ve looked at them and they’re pristine.

  156. 156
    Jimmy says:

    I already think he’s a nasty piece of work, for reasons entirely separate to this.

    To think he was a tax dodger, he would have to dodge tax, which with one exception, he does not appear to have done. The exception would be the allegation that he funded his campaign from gross rather than net income (although this allegation seems to have disappeared now). If he did, then he should of course cough up pronto, but the rest of this seems very thin gruel indeed.

  157. 157
    Jimmy says:

    I already think he’s a nasty piece of work, for reasons entirely separate to this.

    To think he was a tax dodger, he would have to dodge tax, which with one exception, he does not appe@r to have done. The exception would be the allegation that he funded his campaign from gross rather than net income (although this allegation seems to have disappeared now). If he did, then he should of course cough up pronto, but the rest of this seems very thin gruel indeed.

  158. 158
    Jimmy says:

    I already think he’s a nasty piece of work, for reasons entirely separate to this.

    To think he was a tax dodger, he would have to dodge tax, which with one exception, he does not appe@r to have done. The exception would be the allegation that he funded his campaign from gross rather than net income (although this allegation seems to have disappe@red now). If he did, then he should of course cough up pronto, but the rest of this seems very thin gruel indeed.

  159. 159
    BBC the Labour Party Mouthpiece says:

  160. 160
    anon. says:

    Red ken stealing from the NHS,because he deserves the £ cash. Does a premature baby really need an expensive incubator? Of course not.

  161. 161
    Blue Nun says:

    Very poor Jimmy, now go back in the corner.

  162. 162
    Anonymous says:

    Sack Cameron – Elect A Tory says:; I have never been a union member or member of any political party.

    I am a floating voter who only care under which government I can make more money. Under these idiots economy is not growing and banks are lending. So most small and medium businesses aren’t doing badly.

  163. 163
    Jimmy says:

    I love Ken he’s my hero!

  164. 164

    “Britain is a democracy where we can say what we want”

    And those pathetic BBC wankers probably believe it and all…. Those bastards would never have a thought that could fall foul of all the bloody ‘hate crimes’…

    Gawd I hate the BBC so much.

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01dbmwh/features/how-it-works

  165. 165
    nellnewman says:

    What is it about arrogant labour when they get themselves into a hole they start digging even faster.

    We used to say it of gordon and his bully boys and now it looks like ken has taken on his mantle. The more he screams his innocence the more closely everyone looks at his doubtful accounts and finds even more to question.

  166. 166
    Sack Cameron - Elect A Tory says:

    Our current political masters are idiots?

    Then we agree on at least one thing

  167. 167
    Rent-Seeker says:

    Jenny Jones is actually the one who is most dependant for her income on the voters’ whim. Go figure. She is more of a polticial parasite than Ken, but at least she pays her taxes, even if it is a fiction in the case of any politician to tax them on thier income from taxpayers.

  168. 168
    Southend Peer says:

    Great programme on ShiTV at the moment on the obscenity of excessive executive pay.

  169. 169
    I don't need no doctor says:

    Where is Ed Miliband’s moral compass over Livingstone’s tax avoidance. It seems Miliband can accuse the conservatives of looking after the rich, but he doesn’t accuse Livingstone of looking after himself. Miliband is an hypocritical shyster.
    Labour are scum.

  170. 170
    Up shit creek says:

    A scary thought has been scaring me.

    What if the Government really aren’t fit to govern?

    Now that I’ve recovered from the blast of scorn you all just harrumphed at me, (“Well, of course they’re unfit to govern”) I mean really unfit to govern. Literally incapable?

    I mean, we’ve had incompetent ministers before, or shambolic departments, or disastrous decisions taken undemocratically. We’ve had sleaze and scandals, out-of-touch chancellors and dodgy economics. We’ve had inequality, we’ve endured arrogance, we’ve seen tough times and recessions.

    Our high streets have looked just as desolate before, our living standards have been squeezed, it’s not the first time unemployment has soared to the 3 million or so it is today.

    I’m sure we’ve had Prime Ministers more lazy – some may even have taken more holidays than our own. I imagine there may be one somewhere back in the mists of time who has made more U-Turns.

    The Tudors were very fond of criminal spin doctors, I’m sure they encouraged strikes and unrest during the Industrial Revolution. We tried austerity in the 30s and got it horribly wrong then too. We’ve had a two tier education system before and we’ve seen politicians argue against the existence of a National Health Service.

    Previous Chancellors have designed car-crash budgets and it’s far from the first time disabled people have been used as a convenient punch-bag. Why, it used to be de-rigeur to see cripples with begging bowls, in rags, outside the gin joints. It’s certainly not the first time our civil liberties have been threatened.

    But all of it? All at once? Not one minister capable of getting something right? All of them lying to us and to Parliament? A Chancellor so wrong it hurts? A Prime Minister so flaky, his new nickname is “Cadbury’s? A Home Secretary that the police detest, and an education minister reviled by teachers? No, more than reviled, mocked for his odd megalomania? A Justice secretary ripping up our Human Rights and access to, erm, justice. A Work and Pensions Minister hell bent on a zealous, slightly Spanish-Revolutionary mission? I haven’t even mentioned the Health secretary – my adjective-drive is overheating.

    There are no job interviews to become an MP. Experience is not required. You don’t need to understand the NHS to run the health portfolio, or to have been a teacher to dabble in schools. In fact, you don’t need to have had any kind of job at all.

    What if, 2010 was the year we elected a Government so incapable it’s actually dangerous?

  171. 171
    Radio 5 Live says:

    And now, a panel discussion with Jacqui Smith on the topic: Why don’t you ever hear about socialism on the radio any more?

  172. 172
    BBC One Controller says:

    Instead of the usual ‘Question Time’ bollocks we thought prime time BBC One should look in to ‘Sexism in Football?’. But stay tuned for the full season as in the coming weeks we have ‘Homophobia in Football?’ and ‘Racism in Football?’ and ‘Islamophobia in Football?’ and ‘Is Football too White?” and ‘Do Footballers pay enough Tax?’.

  173. 173
    Tony Blair says:

    People not paying taxes.
    I’m shocked to think things like this could happen in a country where some of my best houses live.

  174. 174
    Anonymous says:

    FFS I can’t be bothered to read the comments so someone has probably already said that NI does not pay for the NHS – it is just part of the overall tax take. Also, if you take money from a company as dividends then there is a tax liability (some of it covered by a dividend tax credit) and just try getting any form of social security benefity if you hit a period on non-earning. Pratts (GF and Ken)

  175. 175
    BBC One Controller says:

    Move along now Nell as there’s nothing to see hear!

    We are infoming the public of how much tax Ken paid, but not how much he earned as we feel that’s fair and unbiased.

  176. 176
    Anonymous says:

    Sack Cameron – Elect A Tory says:

    Idiots will be mild.

  177. 177
    Jimmy says:

    Wasn’t that in the budget?

  178. 178
    Losing electoral impetus says:

    The Big Inertia

  179. 179
    David Miliband says:

    That is a very original observation, well put. You have pursuaded me to resign from Parliament and from the party for having failed to prevent my brother from becoming the leader of the Labour party. To atone for the disappointment which the nation feels, I shall retrain as a road sweeper and dedicate my life to removing chewing gum from the pavements

  180. 180
    Prolly Pot says:

    Please stop sending me emails asking if I’m going to protest outside Ken’s house like I did outside Topshop.

    Of course I’m bloody we’ll not. And Boris should be ashamed of making a frail old man like Ken look so weak.

    I think only Tory voters should pay taxes anyway.

  181. 181
    Joe Public says:

    If National Insurance doesn’t pay for the NHS and Road Tax doesn’t pay for the roads any more then why the fuck are we paying it at all!

  182. 182
    Let's be realistic says:

    Do you seriously think that Ken Livingstone will ever have recourse to contributory benefits? his mates in Venezuela will look after him.

  183. 183
    I don't need no doctor says:

    Comendable David. I hope you don’t come unstuck in your new job.

  184. 184

    Who is this other David Cameron who said If we want to stop the state controlling us, we must confront this surveillance state?

  185. 185
    Victoria Drearyshire says:

    A single woman, addicted to drugs, forces her children to steal from Tesco to feed her habit.

    Why won’t the government give her her own Tesco ?

  186. 186
    Anonymous says:

    Guido, don’t forget the Employers National Insurance at 13%, which he will ALSO be evading by paying dividends.

  187. 187
    British Public says:

    No, it’s in our unconscious minds all the time though.

  188. 188
    EUSSR Thought Police says:

    Stop now! Save yourselves a whole lot of trouble!

  189. 189
    Tax Bully says:

    The Value Added taxes Act 2005 enshrines the concept quite fully enough, but any of the Finance Acts reiterate it.

  190. 190
    Anonymous says:

    Tower Hamletian says:; would it be Warsi’s country people doing it? The Con chairperson.

  191. 191
    BBC One Controller says:

    A good question Victoria, do you want to appear in our Question Time audience?

  192. 192
    nellnewman says:

    Well Ken and his bagmen are putting so much emphasis on this tax issue and making so much noise in the media about it there has to be some truth that he has something to hide doesn’t there?

    Is he trying one of bullyballs’ oft failed strategies here? ‘tell a lie often enough and the public will believe you’

  193. 193
    Richard Bacon says:

    My guests today are irrelevant as no one is listening.

  194. 194
    nellnewman says:

    Or Ir an don’t forget them!

  195. 195
    A Bloke Of A Certain Age says:

    Its fairly straightforward, if there was no benefit in paying himself by this method as some appear to be claiming, why did Livingstone go to all that bother ? Ergo.

  196. 196
    BBC Radio Braindead says:

    After the break, a new documentary: NatureGuilt presented by rock star New Labour propogandist Brainless Cock.

    We will go on a journey together through the wonders of the natural world. Followed by a hastily tacked-on reminder of why we should hate ourselves and hand billions over to the eco bandwagon.

  197. 197
    the real Richard Bacon says:

    Arrrgh! Stop trolling me, man!

  198. 198
    nellnewman says:

    Well I don’t mean to disappoint you but road sweepers have to be able to demonstrate that they have held a real job at some time during their careers. I’m afraid you wouldn’t qualify.

  199. 199
    A little knowledge is a dangerous thing says:

    “Naval” gazing. Good one.

  200. 200

    I swear to God that if this had been Boris dodging his taxes it would be headline news at the BBC – Lefties – no frigging shame at all.

  201. 201
    A little knowledge is a dangerous thing says:

    Is that a yellow battleship under your shirt, or are you just pleased to see me?

  202. 202
    Anonymous says:

    Simple fact is that no matter how you cut it Livingstone is a Tax Avoider. There is only one reason why he would have his earnings paid into a Limited Company and that is to reduce his tax liability.

    Livingstone should immediately wind up his company and pay tax as an individual just like Boris does. Problem solved.

  203. 203
    Expat Geordie says:

    Is Class 4 NI contributions litterally the old “stamp”? I used to go to our local post office and buy the stamps for my dad when he was self employed. He used to earn a good living self employed, yet only used to pay £3.20 a week for a stamp. Anyway, why Class 4 NI? How does it differ from other types?

  204. 204
    Strad says:

    Ken’s on the fiddle then.

  205. 205
    annette curton says:

    Reminds me of that schizophrenic that suffocated himself with two plastic bags.

  206. 206
    Gordon and Sarah Brown says:

    Ken has done nothing that we have not.

  207. 207

    Are Occupy going to squat in Ken’s fantasy Business offices until the fat cat pays his taxes? Don’t you just love Socialists using Capitalists tax loopholes to make themselves rich?

  208. 208
    Expat Geordie says:

    Treasury Rules do not allow ring-fencing of funds. It is just one big fund and NI is a con.

  209. 209
    Gordon Brown says:

    I am Thor.

  210. 210
    nellnewman says:

    I think you miss the point. Tax avoidance is legal and not fiddling.

    What ken is doing is lying, and persistently so, which is infinitely worse in a politician who needs the electorate to trust him in order to vote for him.

    ken said people who engaged in tax avoidance should be denied voting rights. Then he was found to be ermmm tax avoiding.

    Lying – the greatest sin a politician can be accused of. And he’s still doing it over and over again!

  211. 211
    Gordon Brown says:

    And C4 news, but not a peep.

  212. 212
    David B says:

    Sorry Jimmy but no. The numbers issued says total income so the assumption must be gross. If it is not the gross income the figures presented are not worth the paper they are written on as no valid conclusions can drawn as they were not prepared from the original tax records or by an accountant

    The taxation of dividends is simple. If a person is to receive 1000 of dividend income and they have a marginal tax rate of 40% then 400 of tax is due on that income. The company paying the dividend deducts 200 which it pays to HMRC and pays the 800 to the shareholder. The shareholder then pays the balance of 200 when they file their tax return.

    The figured presented by Ken would suggest that the income was taxed at the marginal rate ie the full 40% . He then includes the tax deduced at source. This is a double count.

    No accountant would present numbers in this way. The figures should show gross income and gross tax so that they can be easily analysised.

  213. 213
    nellnewman says:

    Well of course the militwits have also done it and bliar is the guru who showed them all the way.

  214. 214
    annette curton says:

  215. 215
    Labourunionsbbc we are one says:

    They seek him here, they seek him there, they seek that darned elusive Tory Cameron everywhere.

  216. 216
    Archie says:

    Just in from Iain Dale on LBC: a poll in Grays Thurrock revealed a 90% majority in favour of a EU in/out referendum!! What are you going to do about that, Cameron? We’ll kick your arse yet!

  217. 217
    Expat Geordie says:

    Unfortunately although Common Purpose is a genuine threat to, well just about anyone with a free thinking brain cell in their head, some of the people who have identified the threat are the sort of people that Common Purpose are seriously discredited in the eyes of the public. When you have David Icke denouncing Common Purpose, then you have to seriously think that it is a Common Purpose wet dream come true.

    Is David Icke a Common Purpose plant?

    I still remember Jasper Carrot genuflecting at Icke’s name saying “the Father, Son and the Goalie Post.” Bed wettingly funny. And as for “Icke saves. Well he saved bugger all when he played for Coventry”

  218. 218

    Some call it Enron accounting. I prefer Kenron accounting.

  219. 219

    Some call it Enron accounting. I call it Kenron accounting.

  220. 220
    Red Len - Red Ed's boss says:

    The God of Blunder.

  221. 221
    annette curton says:

    Which bit is it now?.

  222. 222
    Jimmy says:

    David,

    My bad. You’re quite right. I’d assumed without checking the numbers that the income tax figure referred only to the amount from his own return but it is a double count indeed. I think the effect is the same though, in that he has paid (on these figures) about 25%.

  223. 223
    Ed Moribund says:

    If you thtopped putting your finger in there you wouldn’t be so Thore.

  224. 224
    Expat Geordie says:

    Well there will be a second mail service operating in London by then. Little men in orange uniforms delivering 2nd class business mail for half the price of the Royal Mail. I would mention the name of the Dutch company responsible but TNT and orange “uniforms” might draw unfair comparisons with our muzzie brethren.

  225. 225
    Moira Stuart says:

    Tax doesn’t have to taxing.
    Especially If you bury it in a shell company.

  226. 226
    Anonymous says:

    Expat Geordie says:; does this means like you dad, Boris is avoiding national insurance as well?

  227. 227
    Polly Pot says:

    I’m going to protest right outside. Just you watch me. This very minute my twitter followers and I are going to stand right outside the front door and yell

    “Tax avoider- Tax avoider – Scum!”

    Right everyone! Hurry To Topshop!

  228. 228
    groomer says:

    So where should someone who wants to make London a beacon for islam turn to now?

  229. 229
    jethro says:

    Do you ken Livingstirred
    With his tie so red?
    Did you ken Livingstirred
    Can’t lie straight in his bed?
    He’s a Po-li-tician –
    So no more’s to be said –
    With his lies and his smears, in the morning.

    Now the sound of his bus,
    Brought me from my bed,
    And the yell of his mob,
    Which he part-time led;
    Ken’s Accountant’s cries
    Might re-vitalise the Dead,
    But not his cause, or his self, come the morning.

  230. 230

    There is more than one existential quantifier missing here.

  231. 231
    Handycock No1 Trougher in Parliament says:

    I hope Spain doesn’t go down Mark. I have got a villa out there that my boys bought for me. Boaz.

  232. 232
    nellnewman says:

    One of the questions being asked tonight about livingstone’s mayoral campaign is why is bullyballs not out on the stump campaigning for him?

    They were very close buddies 2000 – 2008 . And during ken’s mayoral term he regularly treated balls to slap up meals that cost us the taxpayers £300 a time.

    So why is edballs keeping his head below the parapet now when ken needs him most??!!

  233. 233
    jethro says:

    Don’t worry, ALKIADT, it’s probably only Sigmand Fraud…

  234. 234
    meme says:

    ho ho ho

    the leading labour election candidate for most important post in the country looks ou-of-this-world, has massive property and tax avoidance issues….

    and Ken also looks to have issues in these areas….

    lol

  235. 235
    Stake Dinner says:

    Stick a fork in Ken, he’s done.

    No Jews will vote for him. The obsessive foaming-at-the-mouth Guardian readers who hate anyone with money and especially who doesn’t go out of their way to pay more tax will not vote for him. Anyone with a brain won’t vote for him. Most indigenous people won’t vote for him. Conservatives and Liberals won’t vote for him. 1/3 of the Labour Party won’t vote for him.

    He has idiotic students, milit4nt m0slems, 1mm1gr4nts and long-term dole recipients. It won’t be enough.

    Red Ken, he has done some appalling things but how funny it is tax avoidance which has doomed him. His career is over.

  236. 236

    Oh Sugar ♪♪♪♪♫
    Ah, honey honey ♪♪♪♪♫
    You are my Amstrad boy
    And your loophole’s taxing me…

  237. 237
    Expat Geordie says:

    I asked a simple question, why Class 4 NI? If it is legal to pay Class 4 then on what grounds? My dad paid what was required of him and I presume that Boris does as well, although as I said and will repeat, on what grounds? I think that the fault lies with the tax authorities who have so many different versions which have such a wide variation in the level of tax charged.

  238. 238
    Anonymous says:

    can we see neil and glenys kinnocks tax returns?

    or indeed any one who receives the coveted gold plated pension after being an EU Commissioner.

    After all, we ARE all in this together aren’t we?

    You’re not laughing are you?

  239. 239
    Orwellian says:

    Typical 1984 doublespeak!

  240. 240
    Eddie Bollox says:

    I may be a brainless, malevolent, unpleasant idiot, but I’m not stupid.
    Ken’s going to get fucked harder than Ed Miliband at a union conference.

  241. 241

    M.C. Escher walks into a pub.
    The bartender says Hey, want to hear a joke?

    Okay, so M.C. Escher walks into a pub.
    The bartender says Hey, want to hear a joke?

    Okay, so M.C. Escher walks into a pub.
    The bartender says Hey, want to hear a joke?

    Okay, so Ken Livingstone walks into a pub
    The bartender says Hey, want to hear a joke?

  242. 242
    Ctesibius says:

    It looks like all you have to do is find out where Kenny-boy will be on Saturday and you can get the UK Uncut bully-boys on to him by setting up an action here: http://www.ukuncut.org.uk/actions/new

  243. 243
    Expat Geordie says:

    I’m awaiting moderation on two comments. One mentions a Dutch postal company in London in reply to 119, and the other is a technical query on National Insurance Class 4. Yet I can criticise David Icke and get away with it! What is going on with the moderator here?

  244. 244

    To Anonymous:

    What Ken is NOT paying in tax, you are making up the difference for.

    OK, so you are on benefits. But you are still pay VAT on stuff you buy in the shops.

  245. 245
    The Nine O' Clock Noise says:

    ….and in other news, Ken Livingstone said he has today found a cure for cancer. Denying claims that he is merely “telling lies to win votes”, Livingstone said: “I bloody well have and I will publish it in a respected medical journal, after I am elected mayor.”

  246. 246
    The Good Old Days says:

    There are still a few Blue Peter beacons left about if you look hard enough

  247. 247
    Professor Brian Cox says:

    The two most common elements in the universe are hydrogen and stupidity – not in that order

  248. 248
    manicbeancounter says:

    Guido,

    Lest anyone forget the bigger picture in this. Those who spin one thing, whilst the substance says otherwise are not to be trusted with leadership. Livingstone has more rough edges than the last Government, but comes from the same philosophy – truth is what you make it.

  249. 249
    not a machine says:

    from the whig wham of deficet capable ecnomic effect , so how can a company with £7bn worth of sales , operating from a huge warehouse , not pay any corporation tax , by going via lichtenstein , all perfectly legal , and labour at the same time give away the rebate and sign up for a whopping increase of £50mn a day to the EU , I mean where was the ecnomic genius in that ? I mean he basically enshrined no ability to even pay back what he was racking up …………. Kens 14.5% looks generous when you consider the macroecnomic wonk of labour polices

  250. 250
    Its not called White City for nothing says:

    And now on BBC1 we feature a documentary on the man who wrote “Imagine” , whilst sitting in his mansion just before he went into tax exile in the United States.

  251. 251
    not a machine says:

    please include some trippy background music , to authenticate your posts :)

  252. 252
    not a machine says:

    too fat too friet

  253. 253
    Mil.i.band says:

    Have you seen my new tv series “The Voice” ?

  254. 254
    Red Ken Lyingscum says:

    I wanted Arthur Andersen to sign off my accounts as Arfur Daley refused to.

  255. 255
    nellnewman says:

    the kinnochios?

    do we think they have a more respected ‘accountant’ than livingstone?

  256. 256
    Pong Ping says:

    So a corrupt man wants to run a corrupt city?

  257. 257
  258. 258
    Civil Evacuation says:

    Even the BBC has left Londonistan. Get out now Fawkes before it is too late.

  259. 259
    Mil.i.band says:

    Hit that button !

  260. 260

    One of my favourite quotes :-

    ‘ If you repeat a lie many times, people are bound to start believing it. ‘

  261. 261
    Bіlly Bоwdеn іs thе Grеаtеst Umpіrе еvеr ! says:

    Okay, so a joke walks into a pub
    The bartender says Hey, want to hear Ken Livingstone?
    The joke walks out.

  262. 262
    Fish says:

    Ooooh…Labour Newsnight going to tell us what they’ve found out about the candidates’ income and tax. They’ll find that Boris was very well off and poor Ken only earned £5k (which is probably true but is income was far higher)

  263. 263
    Dignitas clinic says:

    Ken Livingstone is a joke

  264. 264
    Drop a Daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    Yes, expect Newsnight to come out in support of ‘poor Ken’ and slaughter ‘rich Boris’

  265. 265
    Peterooo says:

    Where else would you go to Hide the Decline (in tax payments) than to a climate change advisor. Makes perfect sense to me.

  266. 266
    Post hoc says:

    Isn’t she formerly Ken’s deputy mayor? Ah, that explains a lot… two bites of the cherry!

  267. 267
    Hang The Bastards says:

    Paxman was keen to get agreement from them all to publish.

    Now the infos out and Boris is looking good and Ken as worse as it could get, that fucker Paxo doesn’t want to know.

    Typical Biased BBC

  268. 268
    Drop a Daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    Allegra Stratton sticking the boot into Boris (rich Tory)

  269. 269
    Drop a Daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    Ha fucking ha, Newsnight totally avoid the issue of Red Ken’s tax dodge and turn the whole thing around. Who was that gormless wanker from the Daily Mail? He must be the only left winger that works there.

    Plenty of digs about rich Tory Boris though, but no mention that Ken pays little or no tax. Why didn’t the BBC get an expert on to explain what Ken pays so little tax?

    Oh hang on Ken’s a lefty and is probably doing exactly the same as the scum that work at the BBC.

  270. 270
    My comment is awaiting moderation says:

    The people he claims to employ seem to support his political campaign and do not actually work for the company, so offsetting their wages against Ken’s earnings to reduce tax is clearly a scam.

    Why are HMRC turning a blind eye? Very odd.

  271. 271
    Fish says:

    Oh well. A passing reference to Livingstone’s hypocracy but as expected they and the two journos from left wing papers (Mail and Independent) seemed to major on Boris’ / politicians’ earnings. The BBC also took the opportunity to imply that Boris had a beneficial interest in the abolition of the 50% tax rate.

    Bastards

  272. 272
    Cactus says:

    Does anyone other than anoraks watch Newsnight these days?

  273. 273
    Chinchilla says:

    Nope. No one watches newsnight now, it’s as dead as a Dodo.

  274. 274
    Fish says:

    Enough.

    The BBC has become a sore on the face of our democracy. Not only this but their treatment and distortion of today’s story about Sky TV is utterly unacceptable. Reprehensible.

    As the BBC investigates and judges complaints about itself, there is absolutely no prospect that things will change. They have put themselves above criticism.

    Something has to happen. But what

  275. 275
    Sands of Time says:

    Time moves on. Just a year ago this blog was the future and the Daily Mail dead, now the reverse is true.

  276. 276
    Monty Best says:

    I voted for Ken last time, this time I will go for anyone but Ken!

    I do not like the dishonest way that Livingstone has dealt with this issue!

    If he is this stupid regarding disclosure of his tax affairs, which he said he would ‘fully’ disclose, he is not fit to be Mayor!

  277. 277
    OWEN JONES says:

    I’m just waiting for a yob to say he slapped a slapper because it was in the public interest. THE LAW IS THE LAW AND NO TV COMPANY OR PAPER SHOULD BE ABOVE IT.

  278. 278
    Fish says:

    If you were the real Owen Jones I’d call you a Hunt

  279. 279
    Fish says:

    That should have read c.unt. I forgot the auto mod

  280. 280
    Drop a Daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    So how does the Guardian keep getting inside stories on hacking? Oh hang on one of their female hacks is sleeping with a met plod.

    Of course no information is getting passed is it? (and against the law)

  281. 281
    Rex says:

    If I could vote and I can’t as i do not come from Romania or a country ending in stan I would vote KEN just to bring to am early end to the Islamic republic of Londonistan.

  282. 282

    That’s what comes from drіnking all that Propter Hock.

  283. 283
    Grim says:

    I say Geedo should publish his own accounts!

  284. 284
    Jolly Boat says:

    Have to say those Marshall amps/speakers were the DBs. They even made the rib cage vibrate.

    But also have to say tinnitus is something I would rather now do without.

  285. 285
    Cock Robin says:

    So London uses more water than rains on London. Why is London confused why it has run out of water?

  286. 286

    Why? He is not standing for office.

  287. 287
    Well it's a thought says:

    Who’d have thought, with mass immigration you would need more water, whoa just mentioned mass immigration so I must be racist.

  288. 288
    Anonymous says:

    Innit vote is guaranteed for Livingscum. Four years of self-serving hate coming up for lucky London.

  289. 289

    Ken sits gelded in the cage of his own making.

  290. 290

    It is called emptying the copper.

  291. 291

    You’re taking the pith.

  292. 292
    JH says:

    I think only Tory voters should pay taxes anyway.

    That’s more or less the case already, Polly love. I’d love to see the average NET tax paid by Conservative and Labour voters compared.

  293. 293
    smoggie says:

    It’s called emptying the sack into the hack.

  294. 294
    Ken the crooked says:

    Anonymong, I’ve read your comments carefully, and I am of the opinion that :-

    a/ You are extremely thick/brain washed – and –
    b/ You live in one of Londistan’s ghettos.

    Just go and trawl your pathetic Leiber speil on one of the Leiber sites and leave us alone.

  295. 295
    Ken the crooked says:

    Very true Mr Grimes.

  296. 296
    Esme Another says:

    no body’s fit to be mayor

    why have a mayor anyway

    it’s all bollox

  297. 297
  298. 298
    Archer Karcher says:

    You read the Guardian and believe anything it prints? You are seriously deluded and offer nothing to any serious debate.

  299. 299
    Archer Karcher says:

    Don’t hold your breath re: Bliar. Livingstone was too thick to see the hole he dug for himself, St. Tone of Truth is, by quite a margin, somewhat more astute than Ken Pondlife.

  300. 300
    Archer Karcher says:

    EUrocrats don’t pay income tax, they are exempt from taxation.

  301. 301
    Anonymous says:

    What about bum boy’s (special advisers)? Cameron’s official photographer, etc. They are directly paid by tax payers?

  302. 302
    Lou Scannon says:

    He must be one of those ‘alternative’ comedians. You know – the kind who aren’t funny.

  303. 303
    On Tablets says:

    First and last :)

  304. 304
    My Lord MandleScum of MENSArses and Boyz says:

    Anyone is welcome to look at mine

  305. 305
    Why is his head lower? says:

    Coz Yvette’s got a good suction going?

  306. 306
    Lou Scannon says:

    Hadn’t realised Gideon was a Muzzie :

    http://www.independent.co.uk/opinion/the-daily-cartoon-760940.html

  307. 307

    Deus dona mihi serenitatem accipere res quae non possum mutare, fortitudinem mutare res quae possum, atque sapientiam differentiam cognoscere.

  308. 308
    Hang The Bastards says:

    Its about time we petitioned for the removal of news reporting from the BBC.

    100,000 signatures should do it for it to be debated (see if they run that fucking story).

    Its only fit to produce CBEEBIES and Eastenders… the rest is chite !

  309. 309
    CLINT Cameron says:

    lansley is a c’unt

  310. 310
    Anonymous says:

    Expat Geordie says:; how can Boris pay class 4 NI on salary from city hall?

    Are you saying he is self employed Mayor? He get about £140,000 from city hall and he pays £250 a month as NI, how?

  311. 311
    Dame Edna says:

    That Frankie always was such a wag, wasn’t he, Possums ?

  312. 312

    Comedian = funny
    Alternative comedian = Not funny
    ∴ Alternative ≡ Negation?

  313. 313
    Anonymous says:

    Why Je*s are so special, what about Christians, Hindus, Budapest, etc.?

  314. 314
    Howzithangin says:

    Must congratulate the cat on his German, no idea he spoke the lingo. Thought the F went to Hollywood, where is everybody?

  315. 315

    Ich bin ein obstkuchen und mein vater ist ein Berliner.

  316. 316
    R Iddlispeakes says:

    The Young have taken Umbriage – next stop your local power station.

  317. 317
    Anonymous says:

    Over 65’s don’t pay NI but his company still has to.

  318. 318
    MandyPickleSniffer says:

    The c’untitudinal tendencies of these c’unts is mind boggling…every opportunity they see to be c’unts, they sieze on with such zeal, almost like they believed being a c’unt was a virtue. Ken Livingstone should be banned from public office and the BBC should be severely reprimanded for its gobsmackingly shameless leftist bias.

  319. 319
    Biased Broadcasting Corporation says:

    It’s like a worse version of those ‘yoof’ programmes the BBC used to make in the early 80’s to try to prove they were ‘in touch’ with young people. Not cool and trendy, just embarrassingly bad. No doubt the BBC will be giving Mr Jones his own show on BBC3 very shortly.

  320. 320
    Someone who knows a bit about German says:

    I’m pretty sure “obstkuchen” and “vater” should be capitalised.

  321. 321
    Cato Street Conspirator says:

    Livingstone doesn’t need a climate change advisor to know which way the wind blows.

    (Bob Dylan, c1962)

  322. 322
    Ken (Londistan a Beckon of Islam) LyingScum says:

    OK – I’ll come clean – I never pay my share in the pub – actually, like Georgy (never knowingly outlied) Gallsaway – I’ve never drunk, had sex with a woman or a donkey within so many yards of the what’s it’s name, – or refused a big enough offer from some low socialist scum.

    And that’s the troof! innit

  323. 323
    Pawn Sandwich says:

    The BBC should be shut down. We do not need a national broadcaster in this day and age.

  324. 324
    The BBC says:

    We speak for the Nation.

    Now pay your Licence Fee.

  325. 325
    Radio 5 Labour says:

    NO, no, no, that’s OUR agenda.

  326. 326
    Rich Bastard says:

    Of course I don’t pay taxes. That’s how I got rich…

  327. 327
    Radio 5 Labour says:

    ++LOL++

  328. 328
    Stake Dinner says:

    But if an indigenous person tweets something the guardian readers dislike they might go to jail.

  329. 329
    Radio 5 Labour says:

    That’s right Owen, the Guardian shouldn’t be above the law either, should it? Breaking the law and then claiming it was in the public interest? Or is there one law for Murdoch and another for the Guardian?

  330. 330
    smoggie says:

    Anonymous puts words into others’ mouths:

    No that is not what he said at all. Are you being deliberately obtuse or are you genuinely stupid?

  331. 331
    Ex Conservative Voter says:

    Not through hard work, good qualifications, making lots of good decisions, taking risk, that sort of stuff?

    Blimey. I didn’t realise people could get rich just by “not paying tax”. Jeeze, I guess every wino with a dog on the end of some string is – as a non-taxpayer – rich. And there was me giving them money!

  332. 332
    Where have all the Tories gone ? says:

    At the very least it should be renamed SIC – Socialist Indoctrination Channel.

  333. 333
    smoggie says:

    Kick Grays Thurrock out of the UK. It’s a fucking soulless shithole anyway.

  334. 334
    Anonymous says:

    Hear hear, I hope mainstream media picks up Ken’s lies

  335. 335
    Anonymous says:

    smoggie says:; what is you view on someone on £140,000 paying £250 national insurance a month? Is Boris self employed in city hall? What do you think?

    When some one on £40,000 has to pay national insurance at 13.8%, why is a man (Boris) on £400,000 pays 0.75%?

  336. 336
    Drop a Daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    I think Ken gets Owen Jones to advise him on his taxes. As we know when it comes to numbers and percentages Owen Jones is right 155% of the time.

    According to Owen Jones Ken’s tax is not 14.5% but 1450% and 500% more than Boris ever paid as 25% of Boris’s earnings go to the Tory party and the other 95% of his earnings go on champagne.

    Nicky Campbell believes all of Owen Jones’s statistics.

  337. 337
    David B says:

    Jimmy you need to follow through the whole process. The assumption you are making is that the company distributed all it’s profits as dividends. Even with the limited information we know it did not. Therefore there is a large slice of income held in the company and taxed at 20% which, if the company had not been there would have been taxed on ken at 40%or even 50%. No one can state the percentage of tax actually paid without full disclosure of company accounts as well. All we know for sure is ken paid less tax because of the existence of the company. Something he objects to when other people do it. He has also failed to supply enough information to work out what his tax should have been. The argument about percentage paid is a red hearing!

  338. 338
    Anonymous says:

    Writing as an accountant, if Ken had asked me for advice on what to publish to support income and effective tax rate, I would advise:

    You could publish details of just the personal tax return, which would indicate the tax paid on employment income and dividends on the company – and reading through the lines of what Ken has published this would show a pretty standard tax avoidance strategy through using a personal services company.

    I would however point out that this misrepresents both Ken’s total income and effective tax rate, if, as seems likely from the company’s bank account, Ken had retained some of his income within the company (perhaps for withdrawal through dividends over time, to allow it to be paid in years when Ken isn’t a higher rate taxpayer for example – again all good tax avoidance potential.).

    So the most transparent approach would be to publish both Ken’s personal income tax return, and details of all the income earned by Ken through his company.

    What it looks like Ken has actually done is to publish details of his personal income tax return, then done an add back of a notional amount for the part of the corporation tax relating to the dividends actually paid. This is of course completely misleading, as combines Kens personal income/tax with only part of Ken’s income from the company to make the marginal tax rate paid appear higher. Even if an accountant had individually approved the personal tax return and the company tax return, no competent accountant would put their signature to this presentation as it is completely misleading.

  339. 339
    Labourunionsbbc we are one says:

    Seems like Boris (at least) bucked the trend, unless you are only talking about socialists.

  340. 340
    Lou Scannon says:

    ‘alternative’ = negation, apparently.
    There are all sorts of popular terms that make no sense at all when you analyze them properly.

  341. 341
    Your friendly neighbourhood Watch says:

    Here’a an incomplete list of 312 words that should be avoided or modified :

    http://tinyurl.com/7gco2xl

    I could go on but the ‘bot doesn’t like too many links at once either.

  342. 342
    Gordon Brown says:

    Oi, that’s my line.

  343. 343
    Kevin T says:

    Now that the mayoral election result seems to be cut and dried – a victory for Boris with a healthy increased majority – it might be worth an article looking at the political fallout from that. Won’t help Dave very much but could be a very big nail in Ed’s coffin. It also makes Boris the solid favourite to succeed Dave. If I was a Tory MP asking I would to follow into a general election, Boris vs George is not much of a contest, and who else is there?

  344. 344
    Drop a daisy cutter on the BBC says:

    A female Tory with big tits? She’d get my vote

  345. 345
  346. 346
    Archie says:

    What about Prague?

  347. 347
    Archie says:

    Poping? Is that like catholicising?

  348. 348
    Anne Widdecombe says:

    Hello, sailor.

  349. 349
    Anonymous says:

    People over 65 don’t pay National Insurance Contributions. Ken is 66. These account cover a period when he was under 65 and liable for National Insurance Contributions so check your facts you slimy socialist MONG.

  350. 350
    Benny the Ball says:

    +1

  351. 351
    Expat Geordie says:

    Labour voters tend to be in the public sector, so by definition they already cost us more in tax than we “receive” from them. Personally I think that public sector workers should be tax exempt, with their salaries reduced accordingly. That way we would know exactly how much they were costing us.

  352. 352
    Expat Geordie says:

    Thanks mate. My response to 82 had the word “rep.e.a.t” in it. Not too sure about 119/224 though. Perhaps it just didn’t like the orange uniforms of T.N.T postmen in London and how appropriate it might be in reference to the newest Abrahamic religion.

  353. 353
    Expat Geordie says:

    Wish he was f*****g gelded!!!

  354. 354
    Benny the Ball says:

    I saw it said somewhere and is relevant to Ken’s hypocrisy :-
    The Madrigore of verjuice MUST be talthibianised!

  355. 355
    Jimmy says:

    David,

    I’m not making any such assumption. He’s obviously not liable to tax on a dividend which does not exist. Obviously without the company liability would arise as soon as the money was earned but that’s an entirely different issue. This argument depends on conflating company and personal income, which is misleading, although as you point out, something which he himself has done to push the percentage in the other direction. I agree the percentage business is a red herring, although our host seems quite exercised by it.

    I have a wider problem with this whole issue. I think in the absence of any question of illegality (and I see no such issue here) I believe candidates for office are entitled to a degree of privacy. If parties are to recruit candidates from outside the ranks of their own employees (something they are all getting increasingly bad at), this is not going to help. For a small business this is commercially sensitive information, and for many potential candidates will be an absolute dealbreaker. Any tory feeling like crowing about this needs to bear in mind that this stunt is now inevitably going to be pulled at the next general election and it’ll be the trust fund babies sweating then.

  356. 356
    Moi says:

    So is Eastenders.

  357. 357
    Plato says:

    If he has cheated, put him in prison.

    If he has managed to arrange his affairs efficiently, then good luck to him, and I hope that he uses his business acumen in the service of London’s communities

  358. 358
    David B says:

    jimmy the whole point is did Ken use a tax mitigation scheme to reduce his tax just as he critised others (like Philip Green) for doing the same thing. If the company had not been there he would hsve paid a lot more tax. Holding the income in the company has minimised his tax bill. He wants orher peophe to pay more, why should he minimise his! That is exactly the issue. It is not illegal but then Philip Green did nothing illegal and he still had his stores attacked

    We have a problem in politics that voters think politicians are lieing, skeeming b@st@rds who are just in it for themselves and expect us to do as they say not as they do. Well this issue proves that is what Ken is and if he wants to do the right thing then he should withdraw now from public life.

  359. 359
    Expat Geordie says:

    The First Commandment: “Do it to them before they do it to you.”

    The Last Commandment: “Don’t get caught.”

  360. 360
    Anonymous says:

    Plato, legality or illegality is typical left wing straw man….

    Don’t think legality is the question, the question is what makes it bad when I do it but not bad when you do? Or why are you such a bleeping hypocrite. It always brings me great mirth to see the left stand shoulder to shoulder with a fellow hypocrite.

  361. 361
    Plato says:

    I said “If he has cheated, put him in prison”

    No excuses.

    Otherwise, let him do the job

    Don’t start making up new rules for individual candidates.
    It confuses the electorate.
    Judge the candidates on their policies.

  362. 362
    Jimmy says:

    The idea that no-one can argue for higher tax unless he voluntarily overpays strikes me as a ludicrous non-sequitur. He’ll have done what any freelancer would have done in this position and taken his accountant’s advice. This whole argument is getting very silly. Anyone offended by these arrangements can argue for something along the lines of the American S-Corp. But that’s up to Gideon and nothing to do with this election.

  363. 363
    Red Miliband is a rich Marxist opportunist says:

    Owen Jones is like a little yapping dog biting at your ankles.

  364. 364
    Objective Reality says:

    Plato, there isn’t a single person of any note who has said anything about Ken cheating and or doing anything illegal. What people are incredulous about is the fact that Ken lambastes tax dodging bastards while being one himself. He is typical champagne socialist, screams about cronyism in the city yet doesn’t mind it in city hall.

    You create false emphasis in order to achieve a winning position that Ken hasn’t done anything illegal. But no one has said that ken is anything other than a BIG FUCKING HYPOCRITE!

  365. 365
    Objective Reality says:

    Plato, you were a very clever bloke, so lets try this argument and I want you to turn it on its head.

    Ken says tax dodging bastards deny services for the poor.

    Ken dodges taxes.

    Ken denies services for the poor.

    QED, now if it is morally bankrupt for a banker to avoid paying tax, it is surely morally bankrupt for anyone to avoid paying tax?

  366. 366
    David B says:

    Jimmy that’s fine. Everyone being allowed to use legitimate tax avoidance measures. Can we now have an appology from Ken for his statement about people who use them and publicly disclose the fact.

    The real issue is not that Ken used a tax mitigation scheme but the critism of other people using them and now an attempt to hide the fact by publishing incomplete information. This is a question of Ken’s judgement and fitness to hold office.

  367. 367
    bbc comptroller says:

    Late breaking news the grand mufti of Tower Hamlets claimed that as a kuffir Ken is not acceptable as Caliph of London. He is furthermore subject to fatwa since the newt is haram and touching it renders one unclean. George Galloway was not available for comment.


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