Turkeys Make Pre-Christmas Clucking Sound
Is anyone actually surprised by the fact that 81% of peers are opposed to reforming the House of Lords? Ironically that’s the figure that will end up being elected if the Coalition Agreement is implemented. The Times thundered this morning that Clegg’s plans were facing a revolt. What did they think was going to happen?
With only four hundred peers actually doing any work, or even turning up, regardless of whether you think they should be elected or not, it’s time for a cull. In other news, public sector workers don’t like spending cuts…
Do we really want a mirror of the commons?
a gunpowder plot would be more appropriate
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Saw this and thought immediately of Davey and 18th Century Fox
Not 18th Century. Britain had the best Navy in the world then! 14th Century, more like
Yes, they certainly put the cock in Cockleshell Heroes don’t they?
I secpnd that as I suppose Guido would (gunpowder).
But just a minute, doesn’t cull indicate killing?
Castration they can make a big noise but they cannot do anything
Prepare the ermine lamp-posts!
Cut backs should be implemented with this lot first.
We the people elect our legislators – all of them.
Really?
Yes and look what a dogs breakfast we end up with!!
At least the hereditary peers for all their faults did what they did out of a sense of patriotic duty, unlike the wasters who now get there for being loyal to a party rather than the country, what does Prestclot and his acolytes add to democracy FFS
I think they should bar former MPs from sitting in the Lords.
Prescott’s loathsome presence makes the point adequately.
They just sound like the audience at one of the old music halls with a aparticularily lousy act on the stage
An elected second chamber is a waste of time, space and money. It needs to be an enlarged version of the Privy Council. Maximum 150. All appointed representing key facets of society and 50% women. How can it be representative otherwise. And who else will prevent the first chamber constantly legislating to push water uphill.
If you’re going to discriminate on the basis of reproductive organs, why not discriminate on grounds of skin, hair and eye colour, religion etc, too?
The Lords won’t be a mirror of the commons.
It’s members should be appointed by the parties on the basis of expertise re an area and should be conscious of their role to reflect on legislation to make sure that it is not flawed, unfair, illegal etc.
Then lords would have to be re-elected or (the non elected – tiny – portion) re-appointed on the basis of their records regarding this aim. I think elections should be shorter than 15 years.
I’ve no objection to the Lords not actively deciding on legislation being allowed to mill around the Lords feeling self important when it it is not in session – minus payment or expenses of course.
I hate my self for saying this but I’ll have respect for Clegg if he pulls this off. Bliar didn’t even try.
Add me to your ‘unsurprised’ list….
“It`s time for a cull”
I will get the rope and lamposts ready….
Better to cloud-burst a nuclear warhead directly over London. Just to be sure.
Harsh but fair.
We could blame it on the inhabitants of Londonistan.
Can you just target the palace of westminster? Not Londoners are politicons?
Well, OK; but only if the fallout blows towards Brussels.
How many are there? And what do they get paid?
Too many and too much.
900+ and nothing. Minimal expenses.
£150 per day, isn’t it?
If they turn up.
altho thought it was £300?
Not too sure that the expenses are all that minimal. See Taylor and Hanningfield for details.
Some of them are not above a bit of ‘enterprise’, either. The name Truscott rings a faint bell….cash for ammendments?
Do they still get second homes in Maidstone?
“minimal expenses” for those with a strong sense of entitlement – more than most of their fellow citizens get for a (mainly) honest day’s work.
The most effective ballot arrangement for these Hunt*s would be one held annually to decide which 50% would be inhumanely executed
+1
Seems to me the House of Lords and FIFA have a lot in common. Both are in denial.
A bit like those Egyptian crocodiles.
FIFA are new to the trough but are making up big time for lost ground. Unlike Blatter, our Lords don’t flit around the world in a private jet.
http://www.transparencyinsport.org/
They’ve come a long way since Sir Stanley Rous used to run FIFA from a basement flat in Wimbledon.
They are all Blatterites.
…and incumbent politicians and parties by and large love FPTP. Wonder why that might be?
Vermin in Ermine.
Those troughing bastards are worse than MPs & MEPs.
Most of them are ex MP’s and ex MEP’s or ex Quabgo chiefs appointed by labour over a 13 year period.
Bastards favour bastards.
The whole point of the House of Lords is to provide a sanity check on what the House of Commons wants to do. That process has been subverted by Blair et al with their placemen in the Lords.
We need people in the Lords who value the UK over party politics.
I agree with this, adding only that the sanity check should be based on expertise and independence superior to that available in the Commons. This leads to the conclusion that a small, independently-appointed college of experts in specified fields would be infinitely preferable to the costly and pointless business of an elected House.
As long as the “experts” have no financial gain from their “expertise”.
I refer you to the so-called “climate change” experts for starters.
So that’s a non-starter then.
democracy is too important to be left to the little people
True, I could handle scrapping the Lords if the commons done its proper job (Line by line scrunity of every bill), But most bills leave the commons with loads of the bill unread and unchecked, The lords does do a good job.
‘The lords does do a good job.’
only when the price is right, or have you forgotten Taylor, Uddin, etc.
Look at all the crap laws that came into force over the last 14 years and say again that the Lords do a good job.
Threaten to bomb Britain – no problemo, have a council house and oodles of benef*it mon*ey. Call a police horse ‘gay’ – 10 hours in a cell and a criminal record.
Yes, But they only scruntinze the bills that come tho and tidy then as much as possible, If we elect them then all hell breaks lose, Whos mandate would win the day? The Lords knows it place, Plus didnt it tell Gordon to fuck off with 90 day pre charge dentention?
i wuv u billy
You’re doing so well cripple! Your little brain’s crippled, but you’re trying not to cry!
Mummy in Heaven’s proud of you, cripple! You promised her you wouldn’t cry.
Barking. Absolutely barking.
Gets my vote anytime
I saw a recent quote (can’t remember where, to my shame) that the Lords is better for having people who know things, rather than people who believe things. People come to the Lords after distinguished contributions in other walks of life, so the House enjoys a wealth of expertise and life experience. You don’t get that in the Commons, sadly.
Like Alan Sugar?
Was it a million quid to Labour for his ermine?
There is no value left in the other place – it has been bought & sold by both parties for their own gain.
Enough – close it down.
Sad but true. It WAS a good revising chamber, but labour did not understand it and wrecked it. Cameron has not got the wisdom or courage required to fix it.
That used to be the case Eng but no longer.
The professional political class have long pushed out the farmers, army officers, miners, railwaymen, businessmen that used to make up the House of Commons. Now they in turn are moving into the HoL. Its a place to send ex Mps like Prescott, Kinnock et al. As mentioned there’s over 800 there. Unbelievable!
It really needs to be abolished and started from scratch
“distinguished contributions” – what the fuck have you been smoking?
the only thing that distinguishes these Hunt*s is that they haven’t been caught yet
It seems to me that the Lords has had too much reform. It seemed to be doing what it was supposed to (scrutinise and revise legislation) perfectly adequately before all this mad rush to ‘reform’ took hold. Now, it’s a bit of a mish-mash, stuffed with failed politicians and people appointed for making donations to parties.
I’ve suggested this before, but I’ll repeat.
Step 1 – Ask all Lords appointed since 1997 to step down, and ask the Hereditary peers to return. (I know the hereditary principle is all wrong in theory, but it had had several centuries to ‘run itself in’, and it actually worked rather well, not least because the majority of peers were politically fairly neutral and had no ambition to gain power and status since they already had the latter, and few seemed bothered about the former.)
Step 2 – Start a long debate about what a second chamber should be there for, and how it should be constituted. All the reforms so far seem to have omitted this step. Aim to take several years over it, and build concensus between those of all political parties and none.
Step 3 – Convert slowly. Constitutional institutions serve the nation better if they are allowed to evolve. Forcing change too fast just breeds problems, as we have seen.
Clegg’s current proposals may be well-meaning, but they are too soon upon recent changes, and too radical. They need to be introduced more gradually; perhaps over a couple of decades.
Step 1) Don’t ask, order.
Step 2) Don’t bother
Step 3) Leave it as it was originally
Who does Guido think will be responsible for Political Checks & Ballances… just himself…. make Guido an Independent Lord and stop this country becoming just another Socialist /Communist State
Dirty Bastards
You really are fucking insane, aren’t you?
The House of Lords is indirectly elected by yesterday’s voter, to moderate the House of Commons elected by today’s voter.
Allowing today’s voter to elect Lords kind of defeats the point.
Your point is crap.
talking of useless wankers I see….
Potty-mouthed residents and visitors caught swearing in Barnsley town center are facing on the spot fines of £80.
Presumably there is a notice of non acceptable swear words displayed in the town center for your guidance.
Isn’t it nice to see there is so little for the Local Council and Plod to do in Barnsely they can at last concentrate on really important work!
What about if you swear in a Arabic launge? Have they all been trained in the new english tounge?
So essentially, tourists to Barnsley are in trouble.
“Fuck me, there are a lot of fucking Muzzies here!”
Lol. Tourists in Barnsley. Good one.
Good point.
Nope, only white English people will be targeted. Again…
Councils have an army of highly paid translators paid for by taxpayers to translate documents into 27 different languages, so could spare a couple to stroll about all day listening for swearing immigrants, and then tell them their human rights.
Fi Faen!
Foookin’ ‘ell !!
Some might remember the case of Rex vs Haddock in which the complainant stated that she’d never heard such foul language, whereupon the judge asked how she knew it was foul if she’d never heard such language before.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uncommon_Law
Given the state of the public finances, why not auction peerages to the highest bidder?
I am sure if it was done in public that the BBC could provide tasteful coverage.
Maybe a National Lottery Draw for a peerage each month would be even better; it would add diversity and balance.
most people prefer the “silent auction” arrangement that we have at present – keeps in the riff raff
The Titanic was launched 100 years ago today. Nobody could imagine the horror that awaited – Celine Dion’s ‘My Heart Will Go On’
Turkeys gobble, not cluck.
Indeed. You can tell Guido’s not a country boy.
I don’t give a cluck.
Cull all peers created since 1997 and reappoint those who have made a genuine contribution to public life. That way, get rid of useless oafs like Prescott, Kinnock (x2) and all the other venal timeservers and political placemen.
A cull would be quite easy and fun.
Just send a list with all these allegedly well known names on it to the public and ask us to tick the names of the 500 we don’t want.
Public sector workers just plain don’t like working. They like bank holidays, spurious sick days, piss-take levels of flexi-time, diversity courses, getting Indian head massages at away days at five star hotels, wanky team building events at five star hotels, nominating themselves for meaningless awards that involve them staying at five star hotels, gold plated taxpayer-funded pensions, gold plated taxpayer-funded wages, being unsackable however useless they are or however little they do, going to “social media surgeries” run by Guardian bloggers, agreeing with whatever utter bollocks the Guardian/Independent comes out with, sneering at the Mail/Express, hilariously calling it the “Daily Heil,” sneering at the private sector, threatening to go on strike over a 1.5 per cent pay rise, going to meetings, going to meetings about meetings, Soviet style bureaucracy, political correctness, hosing down undeserving scumbags and chancers with public money, marshaling vindictive traffic wardens, bin stasi divisions and vehicle idling officers to slap punitive fines on the people who pay their wages, describing miserable backroom non-jobs about equality and green issues as ”vital front line services,” claiming that they shouldn’t be laid off because the private sector won’t magically provide jobs for them, drawing up tendering documents for £80,000 worth of electric cars, dominating the audience of Question Time, taking six months to carry out tasks that should take about six days, empire building, expenses troughing, long lunch breaks, subsidised canteens, paying consultants to do jobs their highly paid managers should be able to do themselves, paying temp agencies to do the paper shuffling and paperclip sorting jobs that lower ranking staff can’t be arsed to do themselves, living in complete detachment from the real world and royally fucking anyone that isn’t one of them at every turn though spite, incompetence and a jaw-dropping sense of entitlement.
…and their bad points are?
PARAGRAPHS FFS!
How about this, Cull all Labour,Tory and Lib Dem peers and just leave the cross-benchers in the lords?
A Labour Lord, whose name escapes me, a former Bishop, was complaining yesterday that Dave is appointing too many Tory Peers. I don’t remember him complaining when Blair and Brown were selling too many Labour Peerages.
Party Politics is the problem.
The House of Lords could be the solution.
Bar any Peer who accepts a Party whip.
Scrutinise Party ties closely.
Taylor 12 months
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-13599624
The USA with a population of over 300 million has 100 Senators in their Upper House. In the UK with a population of just over 60 million we have 740 Peers.
If we applied the US criteria we would have a Upper House of 20 not 740.
are there holidays as long as ours?
That’s what the Parliament Act is for.
Slightly more seriously, both houses should be elected, a governing one elected by PR, and house of local, directly elected (ideally by AV), representatives to represent local interests and approve law changes. Simples.
Of course vested interests will veto it in favour of privileged appointees to lock in government interests beyond term and a choice of alternately elected elites with the same policies. Of course also ensuring that one house has supremacy to prevent their will being mediated by the other.
The Independent Lords are that are the last vestige of free sanity left in this country
, their death warrant was signed when they alone opposed Red Ken’s trading regulations that would have seen Scouts & Guides fund raising Bazaars, registered & licenced, traders would have had to register with the Local Council in order to trade, Grandma would no longer be able to sell those delicious cakes to help the local Church, planning permission obtained that may or not, be granted only a few weeks before the event. Communist / Socialist control was thwarted by the Independent Lords as the act had cross party agreement, what we got in the end because of the Independents Valiant Stand, was a very watered down version with the trading controls withdrawn…. selling on e-bay would have been licensed if you sold too many things and judged to be a trader.. Charities, Boot Fairs Classic Car Shows, Church Bazaars, Scouts Fundraisers Etc Etc, would all have been at the mercy of Health and Safety with Council Planning Permission Costs involved,,, I.E. when obtaining your Licence, you would sign away your right to challenge any one of unspecified Authority, entering your home without a Warrant, to see if you comply with all the detailed and complex Regulations, which as ever were intentionally vague to allow the Authority to make them up as they go along. As per the now defunct Kent Act where written into the Act was the Authorities Power to change the act to suit themselves when ever they liked without going back to Parliament, what kind of Law was that and Parliament agreed to it all.
I am shocked that Guido above all people, is against free speech by those few who stand between the People and Politicians, the last vestige of sanity …. the Independent un-elected Lords.
We don’t need two elected Houses.
For review of the viabilty of legislation, set up a Legislative Scrutiny Board, with powers to advise parliament of the illogical points and “unintended consequences” of what they have just proposed.
For a control on policy, set up a National Forum, with one person from each constituency chosen at random, to serve a 5-year term. Not able to propose detailed legislation, but to block any bill from the elected House of Commons. This house would represent what the People really think.
hmm, I like the Athenian ideal of a lottery for the second house, but what if they accept a bribe to approve a Nuclear Power Station in my backyard? I think we should be able to choose who represents our local interests in a second house.
I definitely agree that it makes sense to have the local representation in the second house though. The first house is basically party political, and has little freedom for MPs to represent local interests.
I disagree with an elected second Chamber. Why? For the simple reason, that I would never be elevated to it, if I had to be elected, now all my secrets are coming out. Under the system of preferrment, I have a good chance of being elevated, as I hold so much information and dirt on many of the the important people who make the decisions.
For god’s sake Mike, are you pissed or something? Keep quiet and you will get it all, including another villa in Spain.
so the 16/17th of june I go back to Liverpool and then sunny old Scotland for the 18th for some food party but most importantly FIGHTING