Fabians Attack LibDem Plans for “Lower Taxes for the Low Paid”
The Fabian’s Tim Horton and IPPR’s Howard Reed have jointly authored a paper for Left Foot Forward designed to undermine the case for raising tax thresholds for low income earners. Clearly they are trying to undermine Clegg’s claim to support a fairer tax system, which by all accounts is playing very well on the doorsteps.
Horton and Reed make a number of charges that need rebutting:
- Three million of the poorest households gain nothing from the change
That is only because they simply just don’t pay tax. No tax cut will ever help that group, only an increase in welfare transfer payments can benefit them. That however would further increase dependency and disincentivise them from coming off welfare support.
- Households in the second richest decile gain, on average, four times the amount of those in the poorest decile.
Once again, this is because the lowest decile don’t pay much if any tax – we are really talking about part-time workers and those on welfare. Nevertheless everybody, including the lowest decile, will be better off whatever their income.
- Only around £1 billion of the £17 billion cost actually goes toward the stated aim of lifting low-income households out of tax, the policy would increase socially damaging inequalities between the bottom and middle.
Here we get to the real reason they object, it cuts taxes for the middle classes. According to their numbers, those on low incomes will only benefit by £5 a week and those on middle incomes will benefit by £20 a week. Low income households also qualify for welfare transfers from middle income earners, from free school meals to welfare credits. Is it really unfair against a background of progressively higher marginal tax rates on middle income earners? Middle earners pay disproportionately more tax after all.
Horton and Reed don’t really dispute that the lowest earners will be better off, they just don’t like the distribution of benefits from the policy. They do conclude with a bit of hyperbole: “It could actually harm the welfare of low-income households by increasing inequality and relative poverty.” Nobody is harmed by a “relative increase in inequality”. That is a left-wing myth. If your neighbour wins the lottery you are relatively poorer in comparison but not objectively, similarly those on lower incomes are not made poorer by those on middle incomes paying a little less tax. Nice try, but the moral case for taking those on the minimum wage out of tax is still stronger than the case for taxing them to pay them welfare.
Fabians feed me my lines.
Now off to self harm.
Earliest example of the Jonah Curse?
We’re all laughing at the Gorgon together.
I have not heard of these Lib Dems before but they seem like utter idiots
if 3 million people do not pay tax, then 3 million people should not get benefits.
it is not as if when I am having my bentley serviced I can say, oh, I cant afford it but I ll take a GT Continental
flat tax is the only fair to stop penalising those most at risk of unfair excessive fiscal limitation, in society.
I note Marr did not comment on the Purcell article in the paper when reviewing them with his guests this morning, Despite the headline being on the front page of the paper which one of them held up. Lib Dems are fucked and getting no where, glad the Euro Tory defected, get a good person in his seat. Let’s see if the BBC this week rigorously features Lord Slug Paul’s expense fiddle.
Quick reminder.
Looking back, I wasn’t impressed with Major at all.
But he had much more courage than that tossflap Brown.
Isn’t hindsight a wonderful thing?
these poor poeple should stop being poor then they wouldn’t be poor
I’ve watched that 4 times now…. hilarious!
2010 is 1992 all over again. Polls are saying a hung parliament once more, so thanks YouGov, you fucking arseholes.
I know.
“We’re about to win a batch of seats”
+++++Con hold Faversham+++++
Beat me toot. That was delicious. Should have been followed with “LABOUR FAIL” had the term been in use in the UK then.
Has he ever got anything right?
He hasn’t changed for the better has he? His face looks more like a plate of porridge, and his hair more like a badger’s bum.
No.
Talking bollocks then – talking bollocks now – but very convincingly.
What does that banner behind him say?
Elly centre…
Jelly centre?
Smelly Centre?
Belly centre?
Lochgelly Centre if I recall correctly.
No. But I think you’re close barefootcontessa.
Its Gorbelly centre?
Noun – a prominent belly; a big-bellied person
Gingelly centre?
Bully Centre.
KY Jelly Centre
To be convinced by Brown is an admission of stupidity.Brown is entirely bogus.
he did that jaw dropping shit even then
Fabians, what are Fabians?
thank you for all the Follow Fridays today – just brilliant!
http://twitter.com/SarahBrown10/status/10394442996
Thanks again Sarah Tweet.
If you didn’t post I would miss all these important announcements.
Could someone please explain to me what the fuck that is supposed to mean? I saw it reported when she twated it. What the fuck is she talking about?
C*U*N*T*S
N_U_N’s__C_U_N_T_S They are no fucking use to anyone
Ahem….
Fabians don’t like the English
Send ‘em all back to Fabia!
Is that Howard Reed of the (supposedly) non-political charity IPPR?
I feel another Sith Institute complaint to the CC might be in order!
This is the standard response of the left. If we went by their arguments there would never be tax cuts because tax cuts will, by their very nature, give back more to those who earn more. But here’s the thing – it’s not really giving them money it’s just allowing to keep more of what was theirs in the first place. The same is true of the low paid or jobless. If they get a job, do over time and work hard they will get to keep more of their own money if taxes are cut. It’s an incentive to do what is good for them and good for the country. Simples
Unless we change direction, there will be little left to tax anyway. The country must make as its first priority a growth in real jobs by encouraging employment and industry by all means- and that involves cutting taxes to make work worthwhile, as well as “encouraging” those who have settled into a life on benefits to become less dependent on the efforts of others.
People with more money of their own left to spend will, by spending, create demand and thus employment. But this all goes contrary to Fabian, Brownian thinking, which is so anxious to create equality and “fairness” that it eventually brings the economy to its knees. History has shown this many times.
In other news, Trevor Philips has announced that henceforth the Calcutta Cup will be known as the Kolkata Cup. England will outsource its rugby to a team of highly qualified Bangladeshis, while Scotland will be represented by a team of asylum seekers from Glasgow.
To retain tradition, though, the match will remain as the Black Hole of Rugby.
Dire, wasn’t it? They even broke up the punch-up, which was the only flash of potential entertainment all match.
Not sure that I’d outsource to the Banglas; Asians traditionally dislike contact sports. How about Brazilians, or Pacific Islanders? The latter, in particular, breed some “substantial citizens” (as Bill McLaren used to call them) with the added advantage of some experience.
To 60,and Nick Griffin will be the impatial referee!!!
It also reduces the size of the state and their power over people, as you wouldn’t need all those tax credit bureaucrats, nor would you have to give them so much information. That’s the real reason the fabians don’t like it.
The left seems not to understand that there is always a limited pot to share out. Every time a person qualifies for tax credits, it costs a huge amount to administer. Also it is administered by the Revenue, which has an appalling record at the task, (i.e. it is an impliment of tax collection rather than benefit payment).
The efficiency in simply not requiring someone to pay a tax is much cheaper than the credit system, and the money that the middle classes save will mostly end up in the shops, and therefore directly feeds the productive economy.
What a high tax threshold fails to do is to put people under government control. They no longer have to declare every change in circumstance to the government in triplicate, and they no longer feel beholden to government for their living which creates a huge problem for socialists.
Suppose that every day, ten men go out for beer and the bill for all ten comes to $100. If they paid their bill the way we pay our taxes, it would go something like this:
The first four men (the poorest) would pay nothing.
The fifth would pay $1.
The sixth would pay $3.
The seventh would pay $7.
The eighth would pay $12.
The ninth would pay $18.
The tenth man (the richest) would pay $59.
So, that’s what they decided to do.
The ten men drank in the bar every day and seemed quite happy with the arrangement, until one day the owner threw them a curve. “Since you are all such good customers,” he said, “I’m going to reduce the cost of your daily beer by $20.” Drinks for the ten now cost just $80.
The group still wanted to pay their bill the way we pay our taxes so the first four men were unaffected. They would still drink for free. But what about the other six men — the paying customers? How could they divide the $20 windfall so that everyone would get his “fair share”? They realized that $20 divided by six is $3.33. But if they subtracted that from everybody’s share, then the fifth man and the sixth man would each end up being paid to drink his beer. So, the bar owner suggested that it would be fair to reduce each man’s bill by roughly the same amount, and he proceeded to work out the amounts each should pay. And so:
The fifth man, like the first four, now paid nothing (100% savings).
The sixth now paid $2 instead of $3 (33%savings).
The seventh now pay $5 instead of $7 (28%savings).
The eighth now paid $9 instead of $12 (25% savings).
The ninth now paid $14 instead of $18 (22% savings).
The tenth now paid $49 instead of $59 (16% savings).
Each of the six was better off than before. And the first four continued to drink for free. But once outside the bar, the men began to compare their savings.
“I only got a dollar out of the $20,” declared the sixth man. He pointed to the tenth man, “but he got $10!”
“Yeah, that’s right,” exclaimed the fifth man. “I only saved a dollar, too. It’s unfair that he got ten times more than I!”
“That’s true!” shouted the seventh man. “Why should he get $10 back when I got only two? The wealthy get all the breaks!”
“Wait a minute,” yelled the first four men in unison. “We didn’t get anything at all. The system exploits the poor!”
The nine men surrounded the tenth and beat him up.
The next night the tenth man didn’t show up for drinks, so the nine sat down and had beers without him. But when it came time to pay the bill, they discovered something important. They didn’t have enough money between all of them for even half of the bill!
And that, boys and girls, journalists and college professors, is how our tax system works. The people who pay the highest taxes get the most benefit from a tax reduction. Tax them too much, attack them for being wealthy, and they just may not show up anymore. In fact, they might start drinking overseas where the atmosphere is somewhat friendlier.
What the fuck is a $ ?
About £0.60p
It works out at £0.657 a 9.5% fall in 34 minutes.
Brown out now!
Its what you will be using when the pound fails closely followed by the euro
It’£ what you get when £ome hoon can’t do £earch and replace on a piece of cut ‘n’ paste.
except the rich squirrel away their money offshore accounts or in assets and avoid tax
I thought that was the smart
Sterling Cooper are still working on the posters for Labour’s campaign
Its been very difficult. Even the legendary Donald Draper has had trouble with this project..
However they have come up with a poster. Think black and white artwork of a singing passenger liner at sea on a cold, freezing night.
It shows Gordon Brown, dressed in the uniform of a captain of the White Star Line. He is standing proudly, hands clasped behind him, on a tilting passenger ship’s deck, with water lapping around his feet.
He is not looking at the sea rising up behind him, but bravely out towards the dark horizon of stars.
In the background passengers, some in expensive furs, some in third class clothes , are gripping the rail in horror and panic as the sea washes up the deck.. There are no lifeboats to be seen. But the serene captain is unperturbed. He has a fixed and determined expression upon his face. An expression of a man who is only concerned with the future…
The strap line reads
WHEN THINGS GET THIS BAD IS THERE REALLY ANY POINT IN CHANGING THE CAPTAIN?
What do you think?
ITS BETTER TO LET THINGS EMERGE FRESH FROM OBLIVION, THAT TRYING TO SAVE SOMETHING THAT IS TRULY ROTTEN TO THE CORE.
THATS WHY THEY START FOREST FIRES DELIBERATELY SO THAT NEW GREEN SHOOTS CAN GROW.
That accounts for your dear leader’s scorched earth policy. Don’t tell me, he learned that from Uncle Joseph.
So that accounts for your dear leader’s scorched earth policy. Learned that little trick from Uncle Jo, did he?
NO, IT ACCOUNTS FOR YOUR YOUR DEAR LEADERS SCORCHED EARTH POLICY. HE SET IT ALIGHT. IT WAS ALL OK TILL THEN
What the fuck is that meant to mean?
Picture of an Ipad.
wording in pastel colours, all soft and non-threatening.
VOTE LABOUR AND WE’LL GIVE YOU ONE OF THESE.
Sounds like the captain of the Titanic – I’m not sure this poster will be their best move…
THIS IS NO TIME FOR A NOVICE-BERG ?
Nearly. Trouble is we’re all still bailing out the boat like fuck, and the difference in bouyancy is the deadweight of the McBroon and his fuckwit henchpeople. So, on balance if just one or two of us can be spared momentarily from bailing duty we chuck the fuckers overboard, raise the freeboard, fix the leaks and sail off into a golden sunrise.
Anyway, that’s how I look at it.
White middle-class people need money taking off them not letting them keep money. Didn’t you learn this in sixth form?
Sack this biatch……………. best of pals with Eddy the Ballsup!!
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/politics/article6880882.ece
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/7435901/Sack-the-Childrens-Commissioner-says-James-Bulgers-mother.html
Hmmm. A bit heavy for a late Saturday afternoon after we’ve had a couple of glasses of red wine Guido!
But y’know I quite agree with cleggies idea of raising the tax thresholds for low income earners. Isn’t it possible that that just might encourage more people to try and get off benefits and into work?
Oh wait a minute that’s just what labour doesn’t want isn’t it?. It has, over the last 13 years cynically raised the percentage of people dependent on welfare ( in the belief that the welfare class will always vote labour) from 7% to 29%.
Maybe a lib-con hung parliament wouldn’t be such a bad idea after all!
Its a government thing. Haven’t you seen the advert?
Two glasses a day and you’ll die of a high blood pressure induced stroke and mouth cancer.
Its a wonder any Frenchies live to be over 35.
Yeah i’m surprised all the p*ss head Irish and Scots haven’t gone extinct long by now if it was true.
Oh wait it’s just more nanny state bullshit from the government trying to stop people from living their lives and spending their money elsewhere.
*uncensored version
perhaps they should stop the discounted alcohol in the house of commons bar then.
We simply must end this Apartheid nonsense now! Demand our right en masse , as human beings, to enjoy subsidised alcohol (HoP) in a traditional British setting (HoP) and in a venue (HoP) with a liberal smoking policy. This rabble of bottomfeeders currently in government take taking Liberties to excess!
Oink! Oink!
Left Fart Forward. Idiots!
why does the end of every blog get fucked up like this?
i think we should be told
The recommended weekly consumption of Alcohol (units etc) has no basis in science, it was just a figure plucked from a hat, so to speak.
reply to #37
Gordon is like an alky robbing the last pennys for baby milk from his wife purse.
Well, good evening,
here I am at the outer London region of Hadrian’s Wall to celebrate the 1600 anniversary of the Romans leaving England. Lanterns are being lit across the whole 84 miles of the wall from Wallsend to Solway, about 250 metres apart. In total some 500 lanterns will be lit and it’s a very encouraging sight. We can see no poverty at all here although as it gets dark I’m sure things will develop.
Back to the studio
The Roman Empire destroyed by high taxation, Quantitative Easing (coinage debasement), and the destruction of the decuriones (urban middle class).
I kid you not (as my lecturer was wont to say)
oink
Lack of both food and industrial production (hence no value added) and pressure on the tribute income due to the migration of the Goths were two of the main causes – but since the result of these was, as you state, increased taxation, currency debasement and the loss of the middle class, the parallels are there for all to see.
‘Lack of both food and industrial production’ we are just slowly going back through history
Dig for victory
HOW DO YOU LIKE MY LATEST SLOGAN ??
***********************************
MAKE
POVERTYPROSPERITY HISTORY*******************************
And too few indigenous Romans, batchelors were taxed in order to increase the birth-rate but there were tax-dodges even then and the exercise failed.
The majority of the Roman army in the latter years of the Empire were auxilaries, and non-Roman cotizens (predominantly Germans esp. the Cavalry).
In conclusion, the fall of Rome was fundamentally due to economic deterioration resulting from excessive taxation, inflation, and over-regulation. Higher and higher taxes failed to raise additional revenues because wealthier taxpayers could evade such taxes while the middle class–and its taxpaying capacity–were exterminated. Although the final demise of the Roman Empire in the West (its Eastern half continued on as the Byzantine Empire) was an event of great historical importance, for most Romans it was a relief.
http://www.cato.org/pubs/journal/cjv14n2-7.html
Nothing changes….because people haven’t changed. Strong societies are low tax societies….incentive produces wealth not state diktat
My husband, my Nero ???????????
Nero, Sarah?
More Caligula I think – or hope (Claudius was installed after the assasination of Caligula, and was fiscally prudent, increasing prosperity for his citizens.)
Note to Blinky Balls – having a stammer does NOT make you Claudian, you fucking clown.
We’re going to plant a few trees to counteract our carbon output.
I promise i’ll cut down a TREE FOR EVERYONE YOU PLANT. its all bollocks. Haven;t you noticed that all the ships are vstuck in ice in the BALTIC!!
it needs rebuilding to keep the fucking barbarians in
The lowest paid tend to rely more on public services. The Lib Dems want to cut public services in order to finance these tax cuts. What the poorest in work would gain is offset by what they would lose- for the ones under the tax thresh-hold especially. It’s very very simple.
Services are going to be cut whoever wins – anyone who says otherwise is in fantasy land.
You’re not wrong. But in this specific instance, as the blog linked to says, £17billion worth of expenditure would be cut to finance these tax cuts. £1billion of that goes into the pockets of the poorest in work and none of it goes to the poorest below the tax thresh-hold- the people who will feel the loss of £17billion in public expenditure the most, as they are the ones that make greater use of public services.
(the poorest in work that come above the tax thresh-hold, that should read).
I’m not sure what services they’re preparing to cut, but you wouldn’t need to be a genious to cut billions without anyone suffering – in fact you’d give people back their freedom.
1.) Scrap the ID cards plan
2.) Scrap all these stupid State Adverts on TV
3.) Scrap State Media
4.) Remove all the stupid Equality Watchdogs
5.) Reform the Human Rights Act
6.) Pull out of the EU – allowing business legislation to be totally reformed – reducing business costs from over regulation leading to an increase in tax revenue and more jobs
7.) Scrap most of the existing tax system abd replace with a flat tax.
8.) Reduce funding to Scotland in accordance with the reduction in North Sea Oil reserves and as a penalty for giving us Gorgon.
9.) Freeze on immigration.
10.) Reduction in overseas aid – given UK PLC is virtually bankrupt.
11.) Anything else that would reduce the state and give people back their freedoms.
hmm – if I may
1.) Scrap the ID cards plan
already effectively scrapped
2.) Scrap all these stupid State Adverts on TV
or replace them with something useful, like the scary “don’t get play in a quarry” information films from the 70s.
3.) Scrap State Media
okaay – detecting a pattern here. Surely youcan’t mean impartial Auntie Beeb ?
4.) Remove all the stupid Equality Watchdogs
yes – keeping all the good ones, that prevent all that nasty racist malarkey.
5.) Reform the Human Rights Act
could stop it being invoked in court as often – “I is taking you to the Haig ‘cos this ASBO is like an infringement of my human right and this and that”. Harsh.
6.) Pull out of the EU – allowing business legislation to be totally reformed – reducing business costs from over regulation leading to an increase in tax revenue and more jobs
sure – that should take like, 20 minutes and only cost a few quid to implement.
7.) Scrap most of the existing tax system abd replace with a flat tax.
which bits should we keep ? I’m all for tax reform, but anything that requires mass action within the civil service usually doesn’t happen, unless it relates to civil service pay.
8.) Reduce funding to Scotland in accordance with the reduction in North Sea Oil reserves and as a penalty for giving us Gorgon.
independence and penury for Scotland. It’s tradition.
9.) Freeze on immigration.
10.) Reduction in overseas aid – given UK PLC is virtually bankrupt.
a two-for-one : international responsibility ? No Thanks !
11.) Anything else that would reduce the state and give people back their freedoms.
except immigrants. they’re frozen.
should get rid of them all together, seen the price of the pies in em
Is every service funded by the taxpayer a necessary one?
Is every penny of taxpayer’s money the Government spends spent wisely?
Unfortunately the reason cuts do get inflicted on front line services is that politicians are cowards. It is far easier to let the bureaucrats decide who and what gets the chop and funnily enough it is never themselves. It is a self-supporting structure too – bureaucrats make front line public sector workers lives a misery by sacking them and make consumers of public sector services suffer too, which strengthens the case for increasing taxation and increasing spending – something far too many politicians love doing.
If politicians took the difficult decisions themselves it wouldn’t have to be like this. Sack bureaucrats. Stop services that can better be provided by the private sector or simply shouldn’t be provided by the taxpayer (translation services for one). Stop the mission creep whereby each department has been weighed down with other responsibilities.
We have such a negative bunch of politicians. They are so focused on avoiding bad reactions they have abandoned trying to cultivate good ones – grasp the nettle. Take a scythe (not a sickle) to public sector waste. Slim down the state and slim down the responsibilities of the state and it will work better, for less.
What do you suggest could soak up the masses of unemployed?
For senior troughing bureaucrats, lime pits are excellent, quick and hygenic.
For the thousands of non-jobs, perhaps they could try working for a living instead.
Wanker. I have a job, now, for one of them. It will of course be at a competitive rate of pay and there is no 30% extra unfunded pension benefit liability, but it is a real wealth creating job in my business. There are 10′s of thousands of small businesses like me crying out for people at the right price, all made unavailable by the massive State job creation scheme. And they are all being paid far far too much.
LIEBOUR CHOSE TO MAKE THE LOW PAID, PAY 20P IN THE POUND TAX INSTEAD OF JUST 10P
I repeat, Gordon had a choice this week and so did all his labour MP’s to make life a little more easier for the low-paid. They CHOSE not to. According to the IFS, this decision by labour to make the very low paid, pay more tax is affecting 1.3 million people. He even lied to get his finance bill passed by telling his MP’s that if they voted for 10p for the low paid, his finance bill would fail. The clerks to the speaker in the HofC told Dianne Abott that this simply was not true. Clearly you can see how Gordon, the labour party and the labour MP’s were determined to vote it through and make life more difficult for the low-paid.
I hope he enjoyed his lavish dining and entertaining at the g20 too.
Remember, Labour no longer represents the low-paid, neither do the unions, not one union raised a voice in support either. Why would that be?
anybody seeking to represent the low paid would have to speak Polish.
Labour now represents Benny Fitz Clements and his stella belching mates as they sit on the sofa doing fuck all.
and there’s four million of them
Seriously, Old Holborn, what percentage of these 4 (more like 6m, by my reckoning) non-employed are actually get up from these hypothetical sofas, and register to, then actually go out and vote on, The Day? I don’t think Labour are going to be hitting the soapboxes and getting the vote out in person , somehow:
‘Ere! It’s That C*** off the Government on our estate! Let’s rob him!’
No, OH, not life’s natural Voters.
Sterling bit of exfiltration, BTW, a Gentleman never pays by cheque, what?
Still, must dash.
Oink! Oink!
Old Holborn, try doubling that figure and even then that would be a low estimate of how many spongers this country truly has.
how dare you
No taxes paid since last election no vote simple.
By spongers, do you mean carers for sick, disabled and terminally ill patients who both worked and paid taxes for 30+ years?
No, not the sick or the elderly, but those between 20 and 40 who have zero excuse……let them do what I did at 23 (1974). I went abroad (EC), found a job and built a career. All I could take was the exchange control allowance (50 pounds, I recall) and went for it.
You get out of life what you put in.
Rubbish in, rubbish out.
Sounds uncompromising to entitlement sensibilities, but life’s like that.
It is true that many people on benefits do not fulfill the stereotype of lazy, sofa-surfing, Jeremy Kyle-watching scroungers.
There are many reasons for not voting Labour but one of my favourites is the total lack of welfare reform. We need a system attuned to the needs of society today, after great changes, including de-industrialisation, more women in the workplace, our ageing population etc.
Welfare reform must also be linked to reform of the tax system, to encourage a work ethic amongst those who are ‘sofa-surfers’. Furthermore, we should have a system which does not penalise those, like carers and communtiy activists, who actively contribute to society despite their benefit dependency.
Instead, all the present bunch of criminals have managed is to re-decorate and ‘re-brand’ the jobcentre ‘service’ as ‘JobcentrePlus’ (Ha! More like Jobcentre Minus!) whilst using the money handed over by the Great British Taxpayer to pay for a series of ‘welfare reform’ ministers who have done no such thing.
So what the fuck were these bunch of incompetent clowns paid for, please?
Each one (with the possible exception of Frank Field the first holder of the post in 1997) has been a pointless, time-serving, useless tossflap.
If they haven’t then please show me the welfare reform!!!
Rant over!
Radically reform the tax system and pay everyone a ‘citizens income’ replacing all benefits and allowances. Which party is most likely to do that? For sure it’s not Liebour.
Hi, OH. Only four million of us ??
Have we been culled ??
AROUND 2,000,000 OF US CLAIM INCAPACITY BENNY FITZ…
@ lola:
Although I am unsure of the exact cost of your proposal, it surely can’t be anymore expensive than the current gargantuan benefits system, which employs thousands of civil servants to boss around the ‘great unwashed’. I would imagine the cost incurred in creating your proposed system would be clawed back due to the ‘jobsworth cull’ that would be the inevitable consequence.
And I’m all in favour of that!
Fucking jobsworth tossflaps!!
We should remember that Gorgon’s brilliant economic managment and spending plans have also helped Sterling to drop 30% over the last 12 months, so those poorest earners (as well as everyone else apart from the very wealthy who no have moved assets out of sterling) have also had their pay docked 30% in real terms – assuming they still have employment.
How the fuck does this help me? Here Guido have a boiled sweet, it is all I can afford.
Just remember it was Gordon who fucked your pension.
Vote for me! My wife takes it up the arse.
i’m not voting ukip
I will vote for you then if you meet any of the followng three conditions;
A. I can take your wife up the arse for an hour.
B. You will give me an uncensored video of your wife being taken up the arse.
C. You will give me a pair of your wifes worn underwear.
Pick your poison and our bargain shall be complete.
are you up for mutual masturBation with gordon?
(cuttle) (sharpen)
That’s the marginals in the bag.
they dont want ANYONE to have money.(except themselves of course).
‘It’s perhaps no surprise that the most enthusiastic public cheerleaders for the Lib Dems’ proposed tax cut have not been anti-poverty charities, but Normal Tebbit and right-wing blogger —- ——- (aka Guido Fawkes).’
Tebbit and Guido vs Trots and vegans. Pick your side, chaps.
Good to see Samantha C’s attractive face on the front of the newspapers today, but why for goodness sake did the Tory party announce to the whole world that they had decided to use her as a secret weapon?! She should have glided ‘au naturel’ into the newspapers, popping up in schools, hospitals, on the train, with her children etc. A stilted tv interview will look SO artificial, and it needn’t have been like that!
its camero’s video technique, give a man a video camera and get a director
Anna Arrowsmith?
Has anyone noticed that people are starting to go missing in massive numbers?
we’ve got to eat some how in this depression
But luckily their votes are accounted for.
Serfs and Peasants pay no tax. How could they? They earn nothing but work for the Love of Me, – their Glorious and Beloved Leader.
People with Really Useful Jobs – like Baroness Udder and others that we elevate to the Disgraceful HoL – that place we disbanded then dumped all our useless twats in it, – they earn lots and lots.
Now YOU get on with YOUR work – if you have any.
“Arbeit Macht Frei”
so them lords like don’t do nuffin and get payed.hey thats like us innit
“Brown is a compulsive liar, he has no truth in his soul. He’s a Liar”
IT’S NOT ONLY BROWN WHO HAS NO TRUTH IN HIS SOUL, IT’S THE WHOLE OF LIEBOUR.
Listened to Any Questions yesterday evening. Towards the end, the Liebore panellist, Lord Adonis, stated with all seriousness, “The country’s economic situation was truly terrible when we came to power in 1997.”
Ann Widdecombe picked him up on it – Dimbledore (predictably) let it go.
It left me wondering – do these Liebore idiots actually believe the rubbish they spout, or do they know full well that it’s an outright lie but blatantly state it anyway?
The latter, sad to say
And did you catch the part when they were discussing Broken Britain… Adonis “I look around me and I see no evidence of this…”
Quick as a flash Widdecombe got a cheer with “That’s because you don’t have any constituents”. Total magic Annie… two birds with one well aimed bolt.
The Nazi Goebbels said:
“If you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it, people will eventually come to believe it.
The lie can be maintained only for such time as the State can shield the people from the political, economic and/or military consequences of the lie.
It thus becomes vitally important for the State to use all of its powers to repress dissent, for the truth is the mortal enemy of the lie, and thus by extension, the truth is the greatest enemy of the State.”
Daniel Hannan demonstrated the falacy around all this in the following Daily Telegraph article in January
http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/news/danielhannan/100022697/why-tax-cuts-are-bound-to-favour-the-rich/
Says it all really
remember folks;
everyone is equal but some are more equal than others.
tttttttrooouggghhh awayyyyyy folksssssss
One thing I’ve never understood about lefty economists – why do they assume that they’re better at spending your money than you are?
Because you waste yours on crack cocaine, hookers and back copies of Nuts.
Speak for yourself.
As your newsagent, i do.
Quite right.
I never buy Nuts.
They want to waste all ours on crack cocaine, hookers and back copies of Nuts too.
sorry ‘ “waste” on crack cocaine, hookers and back copies of nuts ?
Know-it-alls are on set on ‘transmit’ most of the time. They are not up for receiving input from others. They want to be the ones giving out, transmitting their pearls of ‘wisdom’.
What they don’t know isn’t worth knowing and when they do learn something well… according to them, they knew it already.
The know-it-all may be a highly intelligent person but their know-it-all attitude makes them narrow minded and less and less able to learn as the years roll by.
Oh – we care – we care!!
Cover Arse, retain Employment!
If you believe in organ donation,prove it. fuck someone
Of course the very poor do pay tax — VAT eats a much greater proportion of their income than it does for the rich. Raising money by raising VAT would hit them hard, as would green taxes on energy for home heating etc.
That is true. Council tax too.
Tax should be related to your ability to pay it.
Lefties don’t care whether you can afford tax, as long as it keep rolling in so they can piss it up the wall.
The ‘very poor’ (that is those on lots and lots of lovely benefits) don’t pay council tax, nor rent come to that. The taxpayers pay it for them.
Some years ago had a bloke come to my office for a mortgage. He worked in factory and earned about £19k. But he had six kids. When I totted up all the benefits and revalued them to work hout how much he’d have to earn to have the same income it amounted to about £56,000 per annum. How the flying fuck can this happen? Me on the other hand, with four kids and running a profitable small business but drawing less than £56,000 (gross) that, got fuck all.
Please explain?
(I refused the mortgage work)
Dear Toyota
So if I am sat in one of your cars and it races away with me. Should I just switch it off, put the gears into neutral, depress the clutch, brake like shit or just assume turkey mode do fuck all and phone the papers?
Horton and Reed, another couple of speccie, goatie bearded twats who loved getting spanked by their dads too much by the sound of it.
Trevor Macdonald is the best, I will not have a bad word said against him. Any failing Tory leader who is desperate to try and get votes on behalf of his missus would do well to go on a Trevor interview.
Q. How many Iranians does it take to satisfy Semen Turney?
A. 19. That leaves 1 to suck on later.
Q. How many Iranians does it take to satisfy Sem*n Turney?
A. 19. That leaves 1 to suck on later.
He’s a racist drunk, is what he is – he once told his son many years ago to ‘get that white bitch out of my house’.
The ‘white bitch’ was my partner.
Discounted Alcohol in the House of Commons? Well, we use their own money to bribe us into becoming their Masters, what else do they expect? After all, we should, really, be getting them to pay for all of our booze ( just think, a few generations ago and it was we who were in trouble for buying them the booze, so that they would vote for us!).
I don’t fancy Sarah Beard or Sam Cam, what’s Cleggy’s missus like?
These Lib Dem folk the media speak of. I don’t think i’ve ever ran across one. Do they really exist? How does one spot them?
Sandi Toksvig is a Lib Dem. Think that tells you all you need to know.
I’ve met the local one. She’s bonkers.
Sam Cam she’s our man, if she can’t fix it no one can.
Meanwhile, just as Lord Ashcroft did, the union has fought a highly successful campaign to get its people selected as candidates in safe seats. Harriet Harman’s husband, Jack Dromey, Unite’s deputy general secretary, is standing for Labour in Birmingham Erdington and last week John Cryer, a political officer for the union, was chosen in Leyton and Wanstead.
“They’re a powerful force,” says a Labour candidate. “They pour in glossy leaflets, drivers, canvassers to support their man. The machinery outweighs everyone else.” Operation Black Vote is frustrated that strong ethnic minority candidates have been elbowed out in favour of white middle-aged union men. The Blairites mutter: “Charlie’s getting people into place to support Ed sperm maker’s leadership bid.”
In the red corner: Labour’s answer to Ashcroft
It’s not just the Tories. The Government has Charlie Whelan directing money and muscle in the marginals
great article and very revealing
its only ever about
POWER
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/comment/columnists/rachel_sylvester/article7054580.ece
Operation Black Vote is frustrated that strong ethnic minority candidates have been elbowed out in favour of white middle-aged union men.
the story?
Meanwhile, just as Lord Ashcroft did, the union has fought a highly successful campaign to get its people selected as candidates in safe seats. Harriet Harman’s husband, Jack Dromey, Unite’s deputy general secretary, is standing for Labour in Birmingham Erdington and last week John Cryer, a political officer for the union, was chosen in Leyton and Wanstead.
I remember in my first week as a political journalist in 1996 hearing Mr Whelan, then Mr Brown’s spokesman, tell a colleague: “I didn’t like what you wrote so that’s three weeks without stories for you.”
Famous for his laddish swagger and his undeleted expletives, he is not afraid to bully those who get in his way. Described by civil servants as an “aggressive hooligan” and a “serial killer”, he was one of the “forces of hell” unleashed on Alistair Darling at the height of the economic crisis.
He set policy on the European single currency from the Red Lion pub and was copied into Damian McBride’s “smeargate” e-mails. For him the ends justify the means. He once admitted in a TV documentary that he was sometimes “economical with the truth” with journalists to help Mr Brown.
From the link;
“Labour won’t increase taxes” Adam Smith Institute.
Liam Byrne, the Chief Secretary to the Treasury, has said that if Labour wins the election, there will be no tax increases. This is a straight lie, of course, and everyone should say that.
National Insurance Contribution rate to increase to 317.5%
AN OTHER wrote:
I’m a member of Unite, I can’t understand Unites blind support of Labour… I saw a article in the Union magazine saying only Labour could save our pensions… the very same Labour party that has overseen the dismantling of the final salary pensions system…
___________
I can’t see any reason for the blind support of Unite – oh wait, I can. I see 11 million reasons.
Unite is a disgrace and I can’t believe they’ve judged the weight of public opinion so poorly in the BA saga. Want to get Labour elected? Then try not to execute the worst public relations disaster imaginable 2 months before an election.
HE WOULD DO WELL TO KNOW THAT JUST BECAUSE IS HE IS A MEMBER OF UNITE, HIS UNION LEADERS COULDN’T GIVE A TOSS WHAT HE OR ANY OTHER UNION GUY THINKS. THEY ARE ONLY INTERESTED IN POWER.
Beware of voting for an ex union man. They have sold out workers, the unemployed, in fact, everybody that they were designed to help.
Union men are just the next useless set of ‘fat cats’ and they’ve had plenty of practice over the past 13 years.
Interesting that your article did not compare Unite’s £11m since 2007 with lord Ashcrofts £4m over ten years. They have six times more to Labour. Ashcroft’s is his own money Unite’s is abstracted from it’s members by default and cycled through a tax loophole whereby they claim to be non-profit making. They invest more in national politics than a small bank. This is the unholy Alliance which has resulted in the ruinous structural deficit. Brown stuffed their mouths with Public Sector pay & benefits in return for their support to oust Blair in Labour’s NEC. Furthermore he subverted any attempt at public sector reform to ensure one million more unproductive jobs in the public sector.
it’s that man Whelan again …
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/charlie-whelan-browns-awkward-link-with-the-union-1920713.html
Why do people keep on about Lord Ashfield when it is ok for Mr & Mrs Brown to be best friends with Lord Paul and receive donations from him when he is a Non Dom Why was this man made a member of the Privy Council and why was Sarah given an Honorary degree 3 months after moving to No 10 bt University of Wolverhampton Lord Paul is the Chancellor
och aye…because its the right thing to do
“why was Sarah given an Honorary degree 3 months after moving to No 10 bt University of Wolverhampton Lord Paul is the Chancellor”
This is inaccurate. Brown has been in #10 since 1997 as the Blairs moved into #11 as it is bigger. It was the right thing to do.
stuff here
http://www.ian-stewart.eu/irs_scotlab.php
Keeeeeppp trrrrouggghhhhhinngggg foolllllksssss
Then squeeze the basic and high rate tax bands together, stupid. You start paying tax at basic rate at, say, £12k a year – at least the equivalent of a 40 hour week of minimum wage – but start paying higher rate tax at, say £35k a year.
What those on £100k a year save at one end, it costs them at the other.
Not saying these figures are exact but it wouldn’t take too long to work out at what figure the change would become neutral.
And, Martin Day, please tell me. Your bunch of pricks in charge say that someone should earn a minimum wage per hour and therefore a minimum wage per week – interms excepted, of course!
Why does your Government then tax someone on minimum wage when they admit that the minimum wage is exactly what it says – minimum?
why did gordon keep going on holiday and spending all his cash on long island rent boys?
Brown is a lying sack of shit.
Trust the BBC to concentrate on his positive qualities.
What are they? Seriously.
The sack keeps the shit off my shoes. Look on the bright side.
oops! Left Fart Forwards was me!
QUICK BEFORE THE FEDS CHANGE IT AGAIN;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pola_Uddin,_Baroness_Uddin
Manzila Pola Uddin, Baroness Uddin (Bengali: মানযিলা পলা উদ্দিন; Romanized: Manzila Pôla Uddin; born 17 July 1959) is a British Labour politician and thief.
Deface the vain bastards wikipedia lol they hate it.
Labour wants poor folk paying taxes and then receiving benefits, in the system. The one thing they cannot abide is an independent thought in any human head. Slavery to Brown’s taxes or Brown’s tax credits or both, is all they ever want to see.
Here is a graph that shows the true evil of the dirty fucking filth in Nu Liebore:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/UK_tax_NIC_pounds.svg/522px-UK_tax_NIC_pounds.svg.png
Mother-fucks start paying tax and NI on earnings of just ££6,475pa, and at £20k the evil filth in government at thieving £4,500 off the suckers working for less than benefits.
Notice that the take-home pay is straight line diverging uniformly from the government take (NI + income tax), which is also a straight line.
You can see the Income tax myth for higher earners. The evil filth in government yap on about it going up to 40% for high earners, but at the 40% point, the NI take is static and then continually reduces as a proportion of pay – so the government take of gross pay remains a straight line, and more or less the same as for low earners.
The dirty filthy evil thieving scum-sucking trash scum in government, are lying cheating fucking filth. Under Nu Liebore the thieving from the poor to give to the rich has been obscene, and of corse has increased markedly since the Tory bastards were in power.
On top of the evil inequities imposed on Britain by the dirty vile criminally insane filth, Gordon Brown, the poor have no protection whatever from the police, have to send their children to schools that are day prisons for violent junkies and prostitutes (where the teachers are illiterate innumerate filth from the sewer ramming buggery and inter-racial breeding down the throats of the inmates), are treated like cattle in an abattoir by the NHS, and are are treated with contempt and held to ransom at every turn by public sector trash.
The Labour part hates the poor and does everything it can to grind the poor into the dirt and keep them down.
[...] Fabians Attack LibDem Plans for “Lower Taxes for the Low Paid” – Guy Fawkes’… [...]
A touch of economic illiteracy there on the part of our Fabians. If you increase the tax threshold to £10 grand everyone earning over £10,000 a year benefits from a reduction in tax of approximately 700 quid a year or £13.50 per week. The reduction is equal for all.
It is only those on between £6,500 and 10 grand who get a lower reduction. These people would be working below the minimum wage and so must be part time workers.
A great boost to the economy, far superior to ditherer brown’s quantitative squeezing.
“it cuts taxes for the middle classes. ”
Oh really?
This Libdem measure is not a tax cut. They would raise the money they lose from elsewhere. They are not talking about cutting taxes – they will still raise the same amount – probably more- in tax.
From where do you think? Not the poor not the wealthy but the people in the middle.
I would cut income tax and raise thresholds – hell I would abolish income tax altogether, but that is only affordable if you cut back what the government does.
Other way round. What the gummint does is already unafforable. Cutting taxes , i.e. gummint spending, would save us all money. Income tax – or rather lifetime tax – could easily be abolished.
The Fabians are either mentally ill or liars, Guido. There is a simple test; ask someone to volunteer to pay extra tax, the mentals will do so, the liars will not.
If any mentals are still reading please email me your bank details.
It is a great boost by the economical point of view. I would cut income tax and raise thresholds – hell I would abolish income tax altogether, but that is only affordable if you cut back what the government does.
Can we also explain to these plonkers that cutting taxes is never a ‘cost’. It is always a saving.
This shows the thinking of the left. They prefer benifit increases to tax cuts because it increse state control over the individual. While tax cuts reduce that control
That would be the Fabian verbal diarrhea society then.
If you wish to know how the Liberals will work in Government look no further than Swansea – in the past 24 hours the Liberal ‘Cabinet’ have awarded themselves a whopping 6.5% pay rise whilst at the same time considering firing at least 750 workers!
Or you can look at the millions they spent on bendy buses only to disocver they were too big for the city’s roads so they then spent millions more, and a further two years of traffic chaos, digging up most of the roads and junctions so that the bendy buses could travel on them – now, the bendy buses only travel a very small route and are mostly empty.
Then there is the case of the 100 year old bridge on the sea-front that they HALF knocked down and move half of the bridge 200 yards along the sea-front before dumping it on the promenade leaving the other half of the bridge still in place – again, at a cost of a few million…. and now they are going to spend a few hund thousand having an enquiry into it.
And for all this they give themselves a 6.5% pay rise!
[...] in Uncategorized. Tagged: Fabians, Income Tax, Liberal Democrats. Leave a Comment Hat-tip Guido, who also does a robust job of defending the LibDem policy of raising the tax threshold to [...]
The numbers in the Horton-Reed paper are wrong – the first one that I looked at was 45% out, compared to HMRC published data, the first percentage was only half the true figure according to the ONS paper that they quoted later in the paper. A lot of the others look ridiculous but the don’t quote their sources so i cannot check them
I think that the economy would be in a great benefit because of this step. I would cut income tax and raise thresholds – hell I would abolish income tax altogether, but that is only affordable if you cut back what the government does.
[...] Fabians Attack LibDem Plans for “Lower Taxes for the Low Paid” – Guy Fawkes’ blog [...]