Cameron : We Want a Referendum
Dave is trying to push a firm line on Europe post Ireland’s likely ‘Yes’ vote. The Tories have just emailed out a message from Dave giving the line:
I want to make one thing clear: there will be no change in our policy on Europe and no new announcements at the Conference. There will be no change in Conservative policy as long as the Lisbon Treaty is still not in force. The Treaty has still not been ratified by the Czechs and the Poles. The Czech Prime Minister has said that the constitutional challenge before the Czech Constitutional Court could take 3-6 months to resolve.
I have said repeatedly that I want us to have a referendum. If the Treaty is not ratified in all Member States and not in force when the election is held, and if we are elected, then we will hold a referendum on it, we will name the date of the referendum in the election campaign, we will lead the campaign for a ‘No’ vote.
If the Treaty is ratified and in force in all Member States, we have repeatedly said we would not let matters rest there. But we have one policy at a time, and we will set out how we would proceed in those circumstances if, and only if, they happen.
Tory policy now depends on the success of Václav Klaus, the libertarian leaning President of the Czech Republic, challenging the constitutionality of the Treaty. Guido has met Václav Klaus, and he is a clear-sighted fighter, not a quitter. If he can hold off the EU-elite’s constitutional steam-roller until the British general election, all is not lost.
Holding a referendum is popular across party lines, if the general election becomes a referendum on Brown and Europe all the better. Ken Clarke may have a huff, but he is one of the few prominent Europhiles left in the Conservative Party…
Klaus is a bastard, but he’s our bastard.
Blair is a bastard but not one of ours
Blair belongs to Scotland.
Cameron is Ken Clarke’s little bitch
and Farage is Barroso’s
Sweet merciful Jesus ! Cameron’s sent an email !!
Didn’t he think of the children or the catastrophic consequences of doing something so appalling so devastating and so awe inspiring ?
The EU is finished after that.
Call me Dave has slayed the E.U. corrupt monster with one mighty email.
Alternatively, this is pathetic and anyone who isn’t a paid shill for Cameron are not about to pretend Lisbon is almost here until someone with balls appears to say NO.
oh right,
so where are you building the barricades ?
Although I do not like many of Cameron’s policies and nor do I trust him, he is not Ken Clarke’s pawn. It is a case of Cameron embracing his enemy so he knows where he is.
I wouldn’t be so sure about that.
In any event Cam isn’t working on his own – there are some very clever brains working on European policy. Don’t underestimate people like Hague, Francois and that arch-machiavelli, Kirkhope!
Klaus will give in on the 29th October
All this rubbish about 3-6 months is to try and get little wavy Davy Cameron the nicest possible Conference with little robots cheering him to the rafters until they find out he’s sold Britain down the river to the EUSSR later this month
and Barroso will soon be President Blair’s
KEEP FIGHTING MR CAMERON !
At least there is someone in government with a fkin SPINE who is willing to stand up for the majority of people.
Unlike the bunch of un-elected bastards currently ruining the country !
A lot of great men and women died in the two World Wars. Why the phuck would Poland and Czech’s want to join a bunch of unelected koonts trying to complete what Hitler set out to do ?
Bliar is one of the biggest bastards on the planet. He’s not a bungling wanker like Cyclops, or a deeply disturbing, calculating voyeur like Man of Straw or Lord Backpassageson. Bliar takes evil to what may be its ultimate extreme. I said ‘evil’ and I mean ‘evil.’ Like a poster on a newspaper blog this morning, I am not in the least religious, but I think the poster is correct in suggesting there’s something of the Apocalypse about this seriously unpleasant, self-serving political terminator. His tenure of office in Number Ten, ably supported by his nauseating wife, will go down in history as one to rival those of Machiavelli or Hitler.
I agree with those who believe the gentle, intelligent Dr Kelly was murdered. If the British press had world class investigative journalists of the calibre of Woodward and Bernstein this case would have been blown open and Bliar and his sickening sidekick, Campbell, would have ended up in court. Bliar claims a religious belief that, were it genuine, would have destroyed his sanity as the thousands of deaths and maimings mounted in Iraq.
How many wars did he involve us in?
My 90 year old father (who knows a thing or two) said “Blair is the Devil…” a few years ago.
I asked him why he thought that and he said, “The Devil isn’t a monster, otherwise people would recognize him and recoil, no, he’ll appear to be reasonable, accommodating and charming — people like his style and he’ll make them feel comfortable. The only way to tell if he’s really the Devil is by his legacy and often by then it’s too late.”
So here we are: Iraq 180 soldiers dead, 600,000 Iraqi civilians dead, Dr Kelly hounded and murdered for getting in Bliar’s way. Our 800 year old Common Law supplanted by a Supreme Court of judges who can make up (or as they’d say, ‘interpret’) the law as they see fit and are no longer accountable to a democratically elected Parliament — this was decided over a glass of whiskey with his ex boss Derry Irvine — no-one was consulted. And now he’s President of Europe, with a salary equal to Barak Obama, except people voted for Barak Obama.
Yep Bliar’s the Devil alright. Good call Dad.
you can’t always get what you want
It’s only recently dawed upon me that he has become a Roman Catalogue becuase he thought being a Protestant might be a hindrance to becoming Prosident of the EU.
Ampers
There should be a group formed to FIGHT BLAIR from becoming the president of Europe!
It would be an OUTRAGE , a crime, a total disgrace if he were given this position,. He would have more power than our own prime minister! (hopefully Cameron).
He perpetrated a war against the Iraq that was against the law, and was responsible for thousands of dead and maimed human beings.
How can the mealy mouthed agree to the extradition of R Polanski for a crime of rape, yet allow that insult to humanity tony blair go Scot free, and stand by while he is given the position of Dictator of Europe!!!
Suggestion for a name:- GRAB … GROUP AGAINST BLAIR. Any other suggestions?
Hard to see how he can be stopped, as he has all the qualities they want – dishonest, manipulative, undemocratic, troughing. The EU is his natural home and he is their natural leader.
Blair the anti-christ.
Spot on shit-I believe there should be trials of those who major figures within Nulaba for the way they have with criminal wrecklessness abandonment -ran this country for the last 12 years or so.
It is NOT ENOUGH that they will be removed from power.Blair Brown et al should be made PAY for the blood they have shed in this country.
It is farcical that all they have to do is walk away after inflicting the damage they have done.
I know a dew people who believe that Obama is the anti-christ…
I always thought it was Blair. The dictator of Europe.
Many people have, but I feel that it would be improper to associate Blair with Hitler….
Hitler was an amateur compared to Blair!
When he becomes Mr President he will have 731,000,000 peeps to upset what are the oidds on just one of those being a good shot?
Blair is a Satanist. His claim to have converted to the Church of Rome is a device to make his ascendancy to the thrown of EU president more palatable to politicians on the continent, where religion plays a far greater part in the democratic process than it does in the UK. Remember the howls of protest when the Tories launched that ‘demon eyes’ campaign some years ago? That had to be pulled because it was too close to home. The truth hurts. Satanism is also rife among the US Republican party. Probably Bush jr. introduced Blair to it when they got seriously pally over the Iraq invasion.
Why are you caling the Blessed Dave a ‘bungling wanker’?
Bliar = Antichrist
Blair evil, yes I think you have a point. What I find difficult to understand is how a politician so dishonest incompetent and corrupt can be considered by other European leaders as a suitable candidate for EU president, or in fact, any public office whatsoever. Could it really be that the claims, which I have always thought rather fanciful, about The Bilderberg Group, the Illuminati etc. have an element of truth?
Even if we were to accept his explanation of being misled by the intelligence over Iraq (I don’t), it is still a stupendous error of foreign policy. A man with the blood of hundreds of thousands of innocent people on his hands, also one David Kelly, is still at liberty with no sign of justice any time soon.
Blair’s beliefs? Blair believes in Blair, to the total exclusion of everyone and everthing else, and as you point out ably supported by that odious wife of his.
I agree, could’nt have put it better.
Blair has EMEYE 5 written all over his smug face.
He is a Knight of Malta, which should be all that needs to be said on the matter.
He has sworn his material body and immortal soul to the interests of the Papal authorities.
Blair did not, and did not need to instruct his secret service chums to perform a certain deed. These people have always taken their orders from a much higher place then mere puppet PM or presidential level. Which is only a few levels higher then the average bank manager.
The great pyramid of world power is so far over Blair’s head, he most likely has little clear idea where it ends.
Which does not excuse Blairs criminal EVIL in any way, but I hope the above may add a little clarity to the situation. For please remember, Tony Blair is simply an establishment tool, he has less power over his own destiny then the average citizen. Which is just one reason why he has always done exactly what he has been told to do, and the main reason why he hates ordinary people so very much. IMO TB’s hatred for the common man, is only exceeded by his utter contempt for humanity in general.
People like Blair do not just think the public are no better then a ignorant bunch of self-interested half-wit sheople, bound for the slaughter, or shearing house. People like Tony Blair are TRAINED to know that they are.
Orders are made to be obeyed. After all, are the powers that be, seriously expecting us to believe, during this or any other time, that they would trust the future of THEIR planet to any form of lesser mortal, especially one who has to periodically go through the utter humiliation of getting themselves elected by the great unwashed???????
Well yes they still are, and we, to a very large degree still believe this comforting illusion. Soon they will not even need to bother themselves with the smoke and mirrors type stuff. Big Brother has been watching over us all for many more years then we would like to imagine.
This is why they can so casually remove our representative parliamentary democracy, and the accompanying property rights, while sleeping so soundly in their beds. They know it never really existed in the first place, because the establishment have always had, and still do have all of the political bases covered.
only a traitor would not agree your your post
I hate Blair. Nothing would give me greater pleasure than to smash his teeth out one by one with the butt end of an AK47 then shoot him in the arsehole. Just so he can feel what it’s like.
Please allow me to introduce myself
I’m a man of wealth and taste
soon to be President Blair.
Guess that makes Cherie madam President
GET BLAIR, before it’s too late!
No, soon to be dictator Blair!
Did YOU get to vote for him?
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. Me neither.
Just like Brown. But we don’t want them back.
Anthony Coughlan of the National Platform EU Research and Information Centre in Dublin has just issued the following statement: (PDF LINK)
http://www.westbournemouthukip.com/docs/Statement%20by%20Anthony%20Coughlan,%20Dublin,%20on%20Ireland%27s%20Lisbon%20Two%20referendum%20result.pdf
No ! No! We don’t want a pretend Englishman back!
Neither do we want him elevated to El Presidente!
Who knows what the future holds.
He’s seriously pissed off an enormous amount of people across this world, sooner or later his luck will run out.
Ill drink to that.
No. He now belongs to Rome.
Brown would like to be a bastard.
W.W.
As Mandy the paranoid android once said, ‘loathe him or ignore him, you can’t love him’.
I don’t trust Dave. He is a Europhile too.
And why won’t Dave tell us what he will do if the treaty IS ratified before he comes to power?
I don’t see Dave and a Europhile. In fact the Conservative party has never been more Eurosceptic.
What you mean is he doesn’t advocate a withdrawal probably because the Americans desperately want us to be their Trojan horse in to the EU.
Didn’t you hear Dave ? He WANTS a referendum.
And Brown wants to win the election
but neither is going to fucking happen and those who think otherwise are staggeringly stupid and gullible
Dave did NOT say he wants a referendum. Dave Knows full well that the treaty will be ratified by the time he becomes PM in which case he is saying he will NOT hold a referendum.
Dave is having his cake and eating it.
OK. Stuart Wheeler has bet Dave £100K that he won’t hold a referendum. Dave hasn’t taken the bet and not only that the Conservatives lose £50K per year funding from him. I have a suggestion to Mr Cameron: Take the bet. Take the winnings and put them into a charitable fund for injured Military Service personel. Show you are a patriot worth voting for Mr Cameron. Then we may listen to you and your Party hopes for sorting this Brown/Blair mess out for us and our children in our Nation.
It is essential for our democracy that we nopt only get a Referendum on Lisbon, but on the whole EU project.
Like many of my age, I voted int he 70s for Common Market – NOT for an EU Federal Government. Those who understand the treaty, see where it is taking us: into a twilight where we will be the milch cows of the EU Super-State, To a large extent we already are.
We MUST have this referendum and without it people of conscience and understanding will feel obliged to vote UKIP at the next election regardless of the consqeunced – which may even lead to another Laobur Govt propped up by the Liberals.
I think we shall have to join the Tory party just to keep the pressure up. Time truly is running out, and fast. The Lisbon Treaty contains provision for making it illegal to criticise the EU! – and will not hesitate to outlaw parties which against their project.
When will people wake up!
Meanwhile the Irish sell us all down the river for their own self-interest…
Sam says – I agree. Like you I voted for the Common Market. An EU Federal Government was NEVER even hinted at.
We WANT a REFERENDUM.
Is someone organising a PROTEST MARCH. I’ve never been on one but by god I’d join this one. The thought of Blair being UNELECTED President of unelected Europe would ensure millions turn out!
Yes but not europhile enough. Cameron must go.
All of you banging on about europe are only going to ensure a fourth term for LABOUR.
yeah, like Brown’s going to win!
Hahahahahaha! Pull the other fucking one mate, it’s got bells on it
Prime Minster Brown?
Prime Minister Cameron?
Under an all powerful dictator Blair, WHAT WOULD BE THE FUCKING DIFFERENCE?
Will it really matter if Labour get a fourth term? Aren’t the Tories just New Labour in disguise? What will really matter is the UK continuing as a member of the EU while it retains its current undemocratic and corrupt structure. I think this is worth banging on about.
It’s perfectly feasible that a Lib/Lab pact would get back in. why do you think Brown was giving sops to the Liberals in the form of promoting transferable votes? The North will still vote for Labour like the lemmings they are, and those who can’t stomach doing it but are mindlessly soft-left will vote Liberal.
That’s no reason to vote against your conscience, if you truly believe – as I do, having done endless research, that the ratification and implementation of the Lisbon Treaty spells the end of democracy in Europe (what little is left, and that’s not much).
UKIP is the only party offering us a platform. If Cameron doesn’t show tha the understands what is at stake, it won;t matter whop wins the next election. We shall never be able to vote out our true masters, once Lisbon takes effect.
Its bloody simple until the treaty is ratified or not Cameron cannot give a decision about an alternative.
I personally think that if the Treaty is ratified Cameron does have an option of telling Europe that the UK has been signed up to the Treaty by a government that had no authority to sign away the electorate’s basic constitutional rights in the first place thus making any backdoor ratification illegal,undemocratic and unconstitutional.
Brown is unelected and usurped Blair but owes his duty of care in government,as all prime ministers do, to pursue policies and actions that protect the constitution and wellbeing of the country and reflect his party’s electoral mandate embodied in their manifesto.As far as I am concerned brown is a liar and a traitor for going back on the referendum promise and trying to sell us all up the swanee or should that be the Rhine? to be presided over by a war criminal and his slot gobbed carpetbagging mate.
You may not trust Dave but I would be interested to hear your thoughts on Gord?
Enter stage Right : The newly created Supreme Court, neatly stopping Cameron being “the Decider”
Our new Supreme Court is an advance maneuver. They have been put in place to “settle” any challenge from any quarter. They will ultimately decide on constitutional matters including any Lisbon Treaty ratification.
Have the members been announced yet ?
What are their politics ?
If it is the EU supreme court, I would not be surprised if it sits in private and does not give any reason or justification for its rulings.
Are you totally deluded? The Supreme Court is nothing more than a relabelling exercise. Please, please, please try to sort out your facts before spouting crap.
so we’re all going to be run by President Blair in Europe under an undemocratic European Superstate with Heir to Blair Dave reduced to obeying the EU’s every whim under Lisbon
the words ‘nightmare scenario’ come to mind
and no, Brown winning isn’t the nightmare scenario unless you believe pigs will fly since nothing can save Brown from defeat
GET BLAIR before it’s too late!
I dreamt that Blair is coronated emperor followed by Dave getting in touch with is Cajones and walking out of Europe, leaving EUSSR with Bliar, but not wit us
People should get their facts straight: in the EU power lies entirely with the Commissioners – who are NOT elected and cannot be removed, The are placemen, and the most powerful of them are in place due to politiking by the most influential countries.
Lisbon will remove the British veto in 40+ areas. We have already lost our rebate, and were gross net payers into the EU even before that.
France and Germany are now setting up a powerful axis which will operate within the EU nexus for their mutual advantage. All these moves emphasise the danger to our future if we remain within this corrupt institution. And if we don’t get out now, our only recourse may be to arms. Once Lisbon is in effect, there is NO WAY OUT – dissent has been written-in as treason to the new superstate
It will be an obscenity if Blair does get the Presidency but it’s doubtful the Franco-German axis will support his candidacy, given their new co-operation. If he did succeed, he would not have much political power – but he would certainly add enormously to his millions (wherever he keeps them) and be given a platform to strut the world stage, whcih is what he has angled tirelessly for ever since he became PM in 1997.
Calm down dear. I may not agree with the Lisbon Treaty but I think I prefer it to being associated with paranoid, patently insane bloggers of this type.
Fuck yourself traitor
He is absolutely spot on with regards to the unproven theory of man-made climate change.
As for the Lisbon Treaty, IF it becomes fully ratified, unless Cameron offers a full EU, in-or-out referendum on membership itself, then UKIP will win a landslide.
it wont
Agreed.UKIP gaining a majority is a total and utter pipe dream.Not enough people,whatever people may think here , will vote for them. A vote for them will ensure another 5 years of Labour and even more european integration.UKIP will never obtain a majority or even more than 2 or 3 MPs all it will do is split the Tory vote to the benefit of Labour and/or LibDems
The only way to firstly defeat Labour and then tackle Europe is to elect the Conservative Party led by David Cameron.
Brown is fucked. Nothing can save him.
Stop pretending he has any chance of winning because you don’t have the guts to stand up for Britain. An EU under Lisbon will dictate what Britain can and can’t do and Dave is happy to roll over for the corrupt bastards.
Luckily, not everyone is a spineless lickspittle.
Cameron faces revolt on Europe
Vast majority of Tory members oppose position on Lisbon Treaty, poll reveals
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/cameron-faces-revolt-on-europe-1797042.html
It never matters what the individual members oppose or support, come the day of the vote, the Whip tells them how to think.
One reason that such polls are misleading.
That’s your oppinion and that is what GF offers is a platform. I’m voting UKIP unless CMD says what many want him to do. He’s playing a dangerous game though because UKIP supporters and helpers are soon going to start canvassing to keep our sovereignty which is easier than being forced to change despite the Irish result. Why? Because we know they would lose a vote here in UK. The Irish were already half way in because they have the euro and euro flags everywhere. We don’t.
GETY BLAIR before it’s too late!
WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Under the terms of the Lisbon reform treaty (have you even read it and all the other treaties that it amends?) No nation will have the power to slow or hamper further integration. There will NOT be any more referenda to ratify any future treaty in any state ever.
Under the terms of the Lisbon Treaty, Cameron will NOT be able to slow or hamper any of the EU’s plans for much further and more rapid integration.
Once the Lisbon Reform Treaty is ratified, it will NOT MATTER if Brown wins next year, because Blair will be running the show. If you are voting tory to avoid or defeat nulabour, then you fail, becuase it will be imposed from above.
Why do you think Brown is such an arsehole? it matters not if he wins or loses, because nulabour mentality is running the show on an EU level.
You are saying that we will get MORE integration under labour? BULLSHIT! whoever wins between labour or tory matters not to the EU UNLESS Cameron holds a referendum on membership itself.
If he doesn’t then it will be too late.
How fast will the integration be when they do not have to rely on national parliaments or referenda to ratify? When all it takes is a nod from a majority of leaders in the council of Ministers?
Do you believe for a second that Cameron will be able to hold up that juggernaut??? You are living in a delusional dreamworld if you do.
Catch up, for fuck’s sake. We are not talking about normal national politics as usual here. This is the very existence of Britain as a nation that is at stake.
Do you want to live in a fully independent Britain? Making ALL our own laws? Setting all our own taxes and not subsidising 20 other poorer nations for nothing in return but having to accept a million new immigrants? Setting our OWN levels and criteria for immigration, setting our OWN fishing and farming policy? Running our economy to suit the people of THIS country?
Or in a single EU dictatorship under Dictator Blair imposing nulabour mentality across the EU???
That is the REAL choice at the next election. and millions more people are realising it and realising that UKIP are currently the only valid way to the former.
Labour, Lib-dem and Tories (so far) are all heading for the latter.
You got my vote months ago when hague let it slip that we wont automatically get a referendum.
Tories can fuck themselves with a firethorn bush as far as im concerned they doubletalked like labour did.
You cant trust them to do any thing we want, its all about themselves.
Vote UKIP and get our country back from brussels!
It’s entirely regrettable, given the poor calibre of most UKIP politicians, but the gentleman is entirely correct. The majority of voters have no idea what is in the Lisbon Treaty.
We have a very difficult choice before us at the next election; and the importance of it is every bit as apocalyptic as this. Do you wish to live in a sovereign nation, or as the cash-cow of an EU super-state?
The current climate changes that we are now seeing is a totally natural and re-occurring cycle.
It is caused by precession, the wobble of the Earth on her axis.
It’s a long cycle, longer than man has been keeping records.
One of the dynamics affecting the wobble is the massive wight of ice at the poles.
The ice builds up over hundreds of years and as it does it adds more weight to the poles and creates an imbalance similar to an unbalanced wheel on a car.
The imbalance shifts the spin of the planet to such an extent that areas that were under the ice now orbit through a warmer part of the planet’s surface and the ice melts.
Recent areas of melt have revealed previously hidden evidence of older civilizations which prove that the ares exposed were habitated long ago before the ice built up. Aren’t we living on land that was previously scored by an Ice Age ?
Although man is polluting the plant, man is not having any effect on the natural cycle of things.
It’s quack science being used to tax anything that they want to tax and hide behind “green” credentials and secondly create bogus financial assets called trading credits which the big money cal buy & sell making themselves billions of dollars.
apoligies, my smell chequer has been on the weed
carbon credits.
Mr Fawkes Sir, any chance of switching on the widget to allow a post to be edited (corrected) by the original poster Please ?
Agree 100%, Wobbly. Incidentally, someone did the sums on CMD’s rooftop wind turbine. Apparently, it would take about a year to produce enough power to boil one kettle of water. Sounds about right. The token turbine was purely for Dave to show his green credentials. Prick.
Let’s face it the wisteria that Dave charged us the Taxpayer to cut down was doing more good than his windmill. I bet Dave didn’t even bother to burn his dead wisteria and produce enough heat to boil several hundred kettles either.
Tried searching for an email address for Klaus to ask him to delay but can’t find it. Any ideas anyone?
Not really. we have a history of promising help to the Czechs, but letting them swing. We are better with the Poles but still don’t actually help them.
It doesn’t really matter anyway. If Lisbon IS ratified and Dave’s response is ‘too late now-lets move on’ what are you going to do? Vote for Gordon the RATifier?
UKip will be even more of a desirable force thereafter then, surely?
A vote for UKIP is a vote for labour.
A vote for Cameron is a vote for Blair 2.0
A vote for UKIP is a vote for Mandelson
A vote for UKIP is a vote for patriots
No. A vote for UKIP is not a vote for Liebore, it is a vote for UKIP. The most important policy change for the UK is to leave the EU. The Tories won’t leave the EU, so why vote for Cameron? With our main government in Brussels, who cares who troughs at Westminster?
Vote with your sniper rifles.
A vote for UKIP is a vote for a small group of world class Strasbourg troughers who couldn’t make it with the Buggers, Nutters and Perverts.
A vote for Lib Dem is a vote for Labour.
The Poles have been promised a TONNE of money, mostly as reconstruction money (motorways etc.) and generous farm subsidies, both of which the Commies are stealing (it’s in German and Polish tv all the time over corruption and bribes).
If you’re thinking and relying on the Poles to kick the Lisbon treaty into the middle of the future, think again.
The British let the Poles hang to dry in 1939, they will do likewise to the British with the Lisbon treaty.
Good for Poland – playing the system.
So why hasn’t UKIP with a third of UK MEPs got us a good deal ?
Get your facts right – The invasion of Poland was the reason we finally declared war on Germany.
I’m old enough to remember the bombsites all over London in the Fifties, the result of “hanging the Poles out to dry”. I’m also old enough to remember what my Dad’s Polish RAF mates said about the British. Nothing there about washing lines either. You’re talking bollocks.
It would be more accurate to say that the “British let the Poles hang out to dry in 1945″ rather than 1939. However both are unfair to Britain. What more can a country do than go to war for its ally?
Standard EU approach, throw lots of visible cash at them and lots of invisible cash at the polititans just long enough to get them ensnared, then, after setting their contribution level to the great EU slush fund, they start to suck their very soul out of them leaving them scratching their arses wondering why they are suddenly broke.
Same approach as taking a new girlfriend to the best places that you can afford, until after you get one past the goalie, then it’s the kebab van.
In 1939 the British did indeed say they would go to war over Poland, but for the next year did sweet FA. Please enlighten yourself with a non-EU rewritten history book, or failing that, a copy of the award winning series on DVD boxset of “The World At War”.
The British and Americans then stitched up the Eastern bloc countries at Yalta.
You’re incorrect again. The stitch-up was between Roosevelt, a progressive Liberal, and Stalin, a progressive mass-murderer. They shared the aim of destroying Europe to better themselves. The Cold War started in Yalta.
‘World at War’ should be on the state syllabus in every school in Britain
fantastic series
Poland has rescued, or helped rescue Western civilization three times: Siege of Vienna 1683, Battle of Warsaw 1920 and the skies over Kent 1940. They’ve seen off Turks, Bolsheviks and Nazis and only need to hold out for another nine months against the horde of bureaucratic thugs operating out of Brussels. The mercury-laden, headache-inducing lamps are going out all over Europe and a new Dark Age descends, but it’s not over yet.
Lets be clear GOM. Roosevelt was liberal in US terms but would have fitted very happily into todays Tories.
The invasion of Poland was the reason we finally declared war on Germany.?
Indeed it was, but did we liberate them from any tyrany ? No. We abandoned them to their fate at the hands of Joseph Stalin.
Sorry, but a vote for ukip is a vote for labour will not wash in this brave new world.
We are WAY passed that one.
Post Lisbon, A vote for Brown, or Cameron or the other one, is a vote for Dictator BLAIR!
Only a vote for UKIP would be a vote for Britain.
THAT is the choice for the country. Blair? or Britain? You decide!!!
The only ‘wasted vote’ is one for the party with three names. There’s not a fag paper of policy difference between the Lib/Dems, Labour and touchy-feely Dave’s Nu Conservatives. That’s why I won’t be watching the TV debate Sky are pushing for. I have better things to do than watch 3 traitorous windbags lying their worthless arses off. The media seem keen to have us believe these three conniving layabouts are the only game in town. Fortunately, they’re not!
I agree Boycot 6;30pm. It’s not worth watching them. I’ve made my mind up on UKIP but Dave’s party know how to get through to me if they choose to do so.
Useless Ukip can provide the address.
You could try Klaus’ brother at
S. Klaus
1 The North Pole
Reindeershire
Not sure he’s broadband enabled hence the lack of email.
Chancellor of the Office of the President
Phone: +420 224 372 201
Fax: +420 224 310 853
E-mail: jiri.weigl@hrad.cz
http://www.hrad.cz/en/
GET BLAIR before it’s too late!
Tony please please can I be your Vice President ?
I read somewhere that someone “can’t look at Blair without hearing the Imperial March and thinking of Emperor Palpatine.”
The same poster presumably considers David Cameron to be Count Dooku.
Yet again, Poland Nd the Czechs against the forces of collectivism, while Britain sirs with it’s thumb up it’s arse.
Mandy is C3PO
Was he a Sod?
You always will be, my darling.
9 months
Legal wrangling ?
Don’t make me fucking laugh
It’s VERY easy to sort out, but Cameron chooses not to be a leader, but a wimp.
A LEADER would say that they will give a referendum when they got into power, NO MATTER WHAT treaty / constitution was signed behind the people’s backs. And if the British people voted for get out of the EUSSR, then out of the EUSSR we go.
But there is no honorable people in politics any more – ESPECIALLY British politics, they are ALL duplicitous, two faced b@stards.
I’d personally like to thank all the Irish that voted yes for being spineless wimps and not showing two fingers at their new masters. You will be rewarded for your loyalty with 40 pieces of copper (you had to sell the silver to bail out your ponzi economy you created).
and I would like to thank UKIP voters in my constituency for keeping my local NuLab muppet in place despite a few hundred votes being all that’s needed to get the big Europhile voted out.
UKIP Blair’s secret weapon
Cameron Blair’s secret weapon
Dave’s people get very nervous about UKIP as they know they will take many a Conservative Vote. They also get very abusive too hence Dave calling UKIP racists. Norman Tebbit was quite right to tell people to vote UKIP rather than Tory.
True conservatives vote UKIP. Resurgemus sounds very scared of UKIP and British sovereignty.
STOP BLAIR before it’s too late!
resurgemus is just a euromouse party drone toeing the party line
We have nearly 40 years’ evidence to show that the Tories won’t/cannot take us out of the EU, so explain to me why I should vote Tory for a policy that I do not want? A policy moreover that I think is the most important facing the UK. Nothing is more important than leaving the EU.
Fuck off moron, people vote UKIP because they fucking hate the other three EU cock sucking parties.
Look let’s get into power first.you can’t do anything in opposition.
Tedium is not fear
If you want to kill off UKIP, write to Cameron and get him to promise a referendum on RESCINDING THE MEMBERSHIP OF THE EU!
Cameron has the power to kill UKIP and the Britsnatsparty dead.
Cameron could do that easily and guarentee himself a massive landslide.
WHY DOES HE REFUSE???
If you think that your backward and childish and out-of -date chants of a vote for UKIP is a vote for labour, will make any REAL conservative vote for EL PRESIDENTE BLAIR, then you are clinically insane and living in a time-warp.
The true situation all tories are in today is one of saying “vote ukip – get labour” whilst the reality is
vote Brown = Blair telling Brown what to do
vote Cameron = Blair telling Cameron what to do
Vote UKIP = Britain telling Blair to FUCK OFF!!!
Now tories WHICH DO YOU WANT?
Remember, Cameron could kill UKIP instantly. WHY WON’T HE?
Very good point,
We know why the NuLeibor nomenklatura loves the EU – it gives them a second and even more lucrative career when the voters here give them the boot.
Career politicians don’t much care where their power comes from, so long as they can still strut the stage at everyone else’s expense.
You’re correct, EU = version two. Cameron seems a decent enough bloke, certainly more of a human being than the dithering, tax-grabbing moron we currently have in Downing Street. His wimpish side grew out of the creeping cancer of political correctness, which has affected many more than just the leader of the Conservatives. Cameron should leave pc to the hypocrites on the Nuliabour benches – step forward, Harridan and Millipede and Benn – and say EXACTLY WHAT HE BLOODY WELL MEANS. The public will love him for it. They’re mad as hell and they’re not going to take it any more.
In the end, the pc brigade actually CAN’T censor what we think and say. They believe they can, but if we tell them to their faces to fuck off that’s exactly what they do. I tried it with a left-wing university lecturer and it works. We should ALL do it, every chance we have. Fuck pc and all who cling to her pinafore!
Brown agrees in principle to a TV debate. As Brown has no principles then there will be vno TV debate.
Cameron has assured a referendum and supporting of a No vote if Lisbon has not passed. If it has passed he could assure a new UK constitution that is, like that of Germany and the Czech Republic, designed to protect the rights and liberties of our citizens over any outside Treaty. That would do it and is entirely within the incoming government’s control.
Not good enough.
Too right its not good enough.
CMD has dirty hands and wont come clean.
You did say you wanted our vote davey wavey …didnt you? Then stop being a twat and grow some good old english bollocks you etonian twat.
If I had a cast iron, legally enforceable, guarantee that Cameron would pass a law stating that UK law was supreme, and that all EU Directives and Regulations would have to be properly and democratically passed at Westminster before becoming legal in the UK (no more useless “scrutiny” and no pass = no law), then I may vote Tory. This would completely emasculate the EU of course.
STOP BLAIR before it’s too late!
No need for all that if we just reverted to a SOVEREIGN nation in a Common Market. IE what we voted Yes to.
There should be NO European Parliament or Court either. Further more NO UK citizen should be subject to any laws passed by a European Court or Parliament.
So we now know why Tony stepped down as British PM, withdrew the Lisbon referendum, became a Catholic and has stayed out of politics since. President of Europe was his dream, his ultimate goal.
Budgie @ 223 I agree, but I would have to read the exact wording first. and have that written into a binding EU treaty. As I understand it, post Lisbon, Cameron would not have that power.
A promise to withdraw from the EU would be MUCH more compelling for me.
Oh dear oh dear – why do people still live in this fantasy land?
The Lisbon Treaty will put EU above national law in every respect – and there is NO PROVISION for any way back. Why can’t people understand this? If Lisbon takes effect, it won’t matter what laws we pass here!
Cameron must make it clear beofre any election that he will declare the Treaty invalid unless and until it has been agreed in a referendum by the people of this country. If he does this, he will get a landslide. If he doesn’t many of us will feel unable to support him – there must be no prevarication
We already have that in the oath that MPs swear on taking their seat, and in many other ways – but it has all been ignored. I can’t understand why the Queen permits this to happen – her oath of office too should demand that she points out MPs do not have the right to give away our sovereignty.
One thing is for sure, until there is a referendum in the UK on EU membership here – not just the Lisbon treaty – this topic is never going to go away. It’s fundamental. Maybe we have to slough off the Scots forst however!
Where’s Baroness Scotland
Dave, it’s so simple. Promise a referendum and I will vote for you. If you don’t iIwill not.
if he’s your bastard I assume you are Dick Sniffin back from a weeks granny bashing holiday.
“If the Treaty is ratified and in force in all Member States, we have repeatedly said we would not let matters rest there.”
Just what the hell is that supposed to mean? Dave really should engage his brain before his mout
That should be his mouth, I’m too busy thinking up shitty ideas for pensioners to bother with such things as typing
Go for it Dave Bollocks to the EU and that areshole Blair
i will be voting for ukip at the next GE
There is only one way the Sham Cam Man can make me vote tory and that’s
GIVING ME A VOTE ON THE EUSSR
Watch the tory vote/polls drop like mad now this time next week there be on only 22% all becoz SHAM CAM love’s the Lisbon treaty…
I and all the people i no are now voting ukip
YOUR BETTER START TO HERE WHAT THE PEOPLE ARE SAYING YOU TORY MUPPETS OR YOUR GO THE SAME WAY AS LABOUR NEVER TO BE SEEN AGAIN …….i am so pissed off is iver ukip or a gun
well played dave
Prepare to be sold out to Europe again
Dave knows that soon there will be nothing he can do about the New European Super-state. If he causes trouble or undermines the State, we’ll just impose the death penalty on him, which we can do under Lisbon.
Yes, we want a referendum, whether the Treaty is ratified or not.
Why? IF the treaty is ratified, then the UK having a referendum on it, would be like a parish council having a referendum on the death penalty. The UK will have NO legal power to alter a sodding thing! Why waste the money on a Lisbon Referendum?
Labour has already ratified it, so if all the other nations do, OUR ratification will be final. It would be unlawful for us to “un-ratify” it. We would have NO legal ability to do so. Just like we do not have the legal power to reject the Mastricht treaty or the Nice treaty.
The Lisbon Treaty would prevent it.
However, I would be in favour of a referendum on membership, in or out.
Actually if we want to break convention massively we could as Parliaments sovereignty is absolute within the UK by constitutional convention i.e. no previous parliament can restrict the powers of future parliaments.
The only reason EU law supersedes UK law is because of an enabling act of Parliament back in the 1970s (think it’s the European Communities act 1972).
So a quick amendment to the Communities act and then we can scrap the Lisbon Treaties authority as EU law in the UK.
But this would cause on hell of a stink.
Then let’s have a stink.
The threat alone will scare the shit out of Eurocrats especially if we suspend payments to the central budget pending clarification.
I like this idea.
me too.
Our SOVEREIGNTY MUST BE PARAMOUNT!!!
Me too.
Perhaps this sort of thing is why Dave’s playing his cards close to his chest, he’s not PM yet and doesn’t want it blocked. I do think he’s sincere, Europhile or not, in his opposition to Lisbon. Hague’s always been a constitutional buff and will have a cunning plan up his sleeve.
Would it smell as bad as corrupt mp’s making promises and then breaking them in between looking up from the trough i wonder?
I doubt it.
Which is why we need to do something to protect us, with a functioning constitution and court, like all the other member states have got, and which we can do without interference from the EU.
Referendums in the UK are all advisory not binding.
They may not be binding, but we have never been asked the question whether we wish to be part of an EU superstate, which has legal supremacy over our own parliament.
A massive NO in such a referendum would give legitimacy to anything the incoming Govt decided to do to reverse this creeping power-grab
What’s the point of a referendum on an international agreement already ratified?
Abrogation. look it up.
but it requires a Leader not a wimp
It rather depends on who ratified it and whether they had the authority to do so.
The Liberals should hang their heads in shame for supporting this.
What’s the b****y point of that? Treaty ratified is a done deal.
So what’s your solution?
Just roll over and accept the unacceptable?
Yes that is his solution because he wants the unacceptable.
No, I would withdraw from the EU entirely, wish them well and set to work rebuilding THIS country from the ground up, with particular emphasis on our existing bill of rights, constitution and set about creating a free country that has a genuine dynamic low tax economy, where fractional reserve banking of fiat currency and excessive usury would be outlawed and anyone attempting to ever implement such evil ever again would face multiple death sentences.
Hear hear! Stop paying brussels millions of taxpayers money and spend it on Britain!
Fuck the eu with a big rubber dick.
And get HMTQ to declare UDI from the Commonwealth.
It is no longer ‘British’, so why the fuck should we foot the bill?
I will not roll over
Then you won’t get your belly tickled
Treaties can be abrogated, and in the case of this one, where the electorate have been promised a say, but which has never been given, then morally this treaty has no rights over the electorate.
Remember the good days? Your newly “appointed” PM rushes off to Portugal and signs up after the party has finished, looking like a saddo. Happy days. So little to worry about then.
he ALWAYS looks like a saddo
Strange then how Hitler was so intent on killing socialists wasn’t it!
Trumpeter said: “Treaty ratified is a done deal.” No. As a sovereign nation we can sign treaties and un-sign treaties. Moreover one of our age old constitutional conventions in the UK is “no parliament may bind its successor”.
Show me that in writing
Hell, this is all going ‘down to the wire’, isn’t it? Not sure my nerves can handle this – the pressure on Klaus will be enormous. Can he hold out? Will he?
He’s a tough bastard, he will at least try and hold out.
He survived the oppression of the communists and he recognises the same anti-democratic totalitarianism, thought-crime mentality throughout the EU commission.
He will delay as long as anyone can!
I don’t imagine Danny and co. did their agenda many favours when they told him he HAD to fly the EU flag from the government buildings.
He’ll do his best and if he manages it he deserves a statue on fourth plinth in Trafalgar sqaure.
Heard it tell that Klaus told ‘Danny the Red’ to put his flag where the sun don’t shine.
But not long enough
29th October then it’s a done deal and Dave will have to have a position
29th October is my wife’s birthday and Turkish Republic Day. I don’t want my wife’s birthday spoiled or the Turks upset. But here in Northern Cyprus we are not members of the EUSSR – nor likely to be!!!!!!!!!!! That’s why we came here.
that and the absence of an extradition treaty.
Of course he can’t. He vill do as he is told.
We’ll see.
If dave shows balls on this and sticks to it , i might start to think some mps are human
Cameron is right, for a very long time he has said that he wants a referendum, and good for him for sticking to his guns. Unlike Brown Cameron leads his party.
No he is doing something very strange for a mp , he seems to be sticking to he promise
You are right there, it is high time that politians actually kept their word, respect is earned and if MP’s want to get back their self respect they have to stand by their word.
and thats why labour must be voted out , spin
I think you have the message loud and clear.
niether will get what they want
Hague leads the party, Dave’ a puppet (sorry, that should be muppet), and I should know
I’ve previously thought that we need an indication from Dave about what the Tories would do if they came to power after ratification of the treaty. However, I can see the point in his keeping his powder dry for now.
This much I will say though. There are a lot of people in Britain who do not want to be governed from Brussels. If the Lisbon constitution/treaty is ratified, and governance from Brussels comes to pass, they won’t forgive you, or forget, Dave.
If the treaty is already ratified it will be under a Labour government. Question is what next ?
Dave should still hold a referendum to see if the citizens of the UK recognise a treaty imposed without them being consulted has a mandate. If nothing else if it is yes then the people have spoken, if no then he has a hell of a card for playing Brussels poker. Parallel to this he needs to push down the route of forcing change from within. There are enough people across Europe who oppose the top down imposition and wish to open up the system. To do this he needs to have a clear statement of what his vision for Europe is.
1. Happy to trade
2. Happy to harmonise standards
3. Happy to co-operate where it makes sense
4. Decisions and government to be locally based as fas as possible
5. Open accountable government
6. Published audited accounts
Unless he tells the rest of Europe what he is for, he won’t find allies.
“If the treaty is already ratified it will be under a Labour government. Question is what next ?”
It already has been ratified by this labour government. Until the treaty is ratified by EVERY other EU member nation, we can still “un-ratify” it. When it has been ratified by all, THEN it will be too late!
It will come down to in, or, out!
This sounds very like the ” there is no plan B ” from the Europhiles. There’s always more time and negotiating space if you push for it and the history of Europe is always to say there is no alternative and then to find one .
Quite agree.
We should be prepared to withold our financial contribution to EU until we get an acceptable deal. In the meantime we should ignore any EU decisions made under Lisbon rules.
Yes, we had the original 1975 referendum two years *after* joining what we were told was the Free Trade Area aka Economic Community.
Why will it be “too late”?
Just tell brussels to go fuck themselves.
No surrender to unelected eurotwats.
What can they do?
Threaten us? We’ve kicked their asses before theyre not too big to get spanked again.
Id rather be a state of the US than one of europe, at least they HAVE an elected leader.
Oh how the Irish children when grown will thank their parents for enslaving them to the EU Communist state, all because their lazy parents didn’t want to vote “no” any more, so have an easy life of no more referenda (ever again).
Please Dave, help me stay sane …..Ta awfully…..
We are either in Europe or out, give us the choice. Look at the trade figures. If we left the EU would hey refuse to trade with us? No they need us more than we need them. Where would the Germans and French sell their cars? We once sat at the hub of a global trading network; now we are being accused of being Little Englanders because we don’t want to be f*cked over by Paris lead protectionism.
It was probably a condition to Blair walking away and giving Brown the crown, he must have insisted that Labour support Europe as he was planning to head it up, otherwise I don’t think he would have let go. Britain was a great country before they joined the EU, I don’t think anything has changed, there are lots of countries in the world to trade with.
Agreed… If we had kept the money which we give to the EU we would wouldn’t be in half the shit we are now. No scrap that Gorgon would find other ways to spend it.
This is one of the stories always put about by pro-Euros, that no-one would trade with us, which is absolute nonsense. Before Britian was in Europe we were one of the worlds (if not THE) biggest traders and won of the worlds richest countries.
Being in the EU has done nothing but damage our country. I can’t believe that the Irish have folded so easily. They have spent hundreds of years fighting for independance, eventually get it and throw it away!
Thank Maggie and her service economy for the lack of any manufacturing in this country
The only reason we aren’t allowed a referendum is because Blair has ambitions to become the new Napoleon
Those shits Mandelson and Milband have propped up Brown only because they are trying to force ratification through. I can’t stomach the thought of these three lording it over the whole of Europe. Can you imagine how Euro-smug they would be?
Referendum or Riot. That is the choice.
There is another choice at the next election but you have to be brave.
Read the manifesto of the party whos name you can not speak.
You only have one chance then……
Hello President Blair.
Goodbye freedom
That party is a National Socialist party – eg SOCIALIST – read their manifesto. It is also stuffed full of race hate morons and repressed homos who like young blonde men in nice shiny uniforms. Lady Mandlebum would feel at home at one of their meetings.
Anon – you’re a moronic prat, and you have certainly never read the manifesto of the party you pretend to know about. I see you are also into homo-erotic fantasies yourself.
FIGHT AGAINST BLAIR before it’s too late!
Fight a gainst Dave – he plans to give the country to the bankers
Oh please, Napoleon had personal courage, cunning and shared danger with his troops. Blair couldn’t even stand up to Brown.
That’s ironic. If the Lisbon treaty is passed, we will be changed to a Napoleonic system of justice. You are guilty until you prove yourself innocent!
It is all entirely unconstitutional and a total bastardisation of our Sovereignty.
It is a complete change in our lawful status. Under the EU we are NOT Free. We are NOT soveriegn. We are CITIZENS. That means our freedom, liberty and rights are loaned and only granted upon the citizenry upon the whims of the Oligarchy (and soon to be dictator Blair, perhaps)
DO we really want to have a Dictator Blair, who whilst PM tried to impose indefinite or permanent detention without charge or trial? Who then tried to get detention for 90 days? (thank you tories and Liberals and the Lords for scrapping that)
Blair would become a Dictator who has a long record of lying, warmongering, removal of civil liberties and cheating the tax-payer.
I despair, I really do!
why ?
this country’s always at its best when pushed into a corner.
Resurgemus @ 2.04. Thanks for the reminder of who we were,are and allways will be. Time to wipe the tears away and smile as we grit our teeth. I for one would die on my feet but can’t live on my knees.
Love and hope,
Dixie
It can’t be doing Bliar much good to have his name mentoined agian with the BAe scandal. It won’t be long before he’s doing a stretch.
Cancel the Ferrero Rochet for Bliar!
This is the crux of it all. Giving up our Common Law for some bastardized Roman/Napoleonic continental system will destroy 800 years of checks and balances…
Wonder why they ok with Blair whereas we are not? Look up Common Law on Wiki, it came about not only as what it says on the tin — the same law applies to each and every one of us whoever we are — but also because the judges of the 12th C used to compare notes and thrash out a judgement which would be common to each region — the law of precedent.
Blair’s (and the Blairs’) own undistinguished legal career(s) certainly wouldn’t stand up to this scrutiny, so he’s been fundamentally opposed to our legal system since he took the Bar.
Google Blair & D notice, this is just the first entry! Scroll down.
http://www.tpuc.org/node/34
Interesting.
About 12 years ago, I heard a story about a senior Labour MP (who I will not identify on here) caught with child porn in the drawer of his HoC desk… nothing was said as Labour had a lot of dirt on Tory MPs (but not paedophilia to my knowledge). The MP sort of ‘disappeared’ from his previously high-profile position in government although he’s still around.
This is the way we are governed.
Actually, Nappy deserted his troops in Egypt after the Battle of the Nile (5-0 to Nelson) and led them by a distance back from Moscow.( an innings defeat by General Winter) It was Ney, “Bravest of the Brave” who organised the retreat. He never went up against Wellington until there was no other course left to him. The comparison with Blair is more apt than you imagine.
Napoleon did damage to France that lingers to the present day.
Napolean had personal courage? You mean the Napolean who ordered prisoners to be murdered and poisoned his own wounded men when forced to retreat from Syria? That kind of courage I think we can do without.
Euro-smug ? We invented it and love it !
We’ll give you euro-smug, come the revolution!!! Grrrrrrrrrrrr
brown up for tv debate
http://www.labourlist.org/brown-agrees-to-the-tv-debates
Whoopee!
It’ll never happen.
Don’t care.
Anyone who believes what Cameron says is a sucker.
Partly true, but you can really point to a truth that has ever come out of Brown’s mouth?
The man is mental, delusional and living in a total dream-world.
“a truth that has ever come out of Brown’s mouth”
Of course not.
What entirely confuses me is how sensible people like Ken Clark can stick to the EU line, is he not a democrat ? does he know something the rest of us have missed ? My reactions may be seen as somewhat over the top, but I see us marching blindfold into a potential fascist state, to me it has to be the ultimate end to the path they are trying to take. Will we face sanctions for putting up a fight.
Who cares…probably only Blair as he has the most to lose in not being master of the universe.
GRAB…… GROUP AGAINST BLAIR!
“FAB GRAB”
Reminds me of a nightclub I used to frequent.
No Norman, Ken Clarke is NOT a “democrat”.
He is a Bilderberg long-time attendee (at least 8 times); a QC; staunchly pro-EU aka fascist dictatorship ergo, Clarke, my MP, is one of ‘theirs’ and NOT working in the interests of his constituents ie me + a few others OR this country…
He is Rothschild’s longest serving puppet in the Tory party. He is their to ensure that regardless of what the electorate, or the party want, they will deliver what is agreed at the Bilderberg conference.
I concur Mr Ned – and his opposame in zanuliebore, is Manlescum – ‘they’ openly pitted them before our eyes for once!!
The Truth is always “hidden in plain sight”. The trick is to develop ‘eyes to see and ears to hear’.
It’s a shame Ken Clarke, who’s quite a bohemian laid back jazz loving man has aligned himself so strongly with Europe. I really don’t understand why.
He was quite a good Chancellor of the Exchequer. He has too, been commercially aligned to the British tobacco company which is bad news.
He could have been leader of the tories if he hadn’t had these weaknesses.
Sorry bfc, he’s a fucking traitor- I don’t give a shit what “kind’a” guy he appears to you. He’s on the same team as Blair,Mandy and others. These people don’t have horns!! What next Hitler liked good classical music so can’t be all bad. Suggest u GRAB some new specs cos them rose tinted ones ain’t no good.
With respect. Dixie
Ok Dixie, I believe you!
What sanctions can they impose. We are not going to sell you any more German cars or French golden delicious apples LOL. We are an island with a powerful army, airforce and navy with trident subs. We can trade via sea and air with the rest of he world.
Can anyone tell me what Europe has that we can’t make ourselves or obtain via trade?
Long term this is might be true.
In the short term it would be slightly trickier. For one thing, we’ve sold our nuclear generation to the French, another is that even if we went back to coal, most of the pits are inoperable after 20 years mothballing, our gas supply is mostly dependent on a European pipeline. And our oil is running out in the North Sea.
I’m quite up for it, managed without power for 6 weeks after the ’87 hurricane and worked throught the 3-day week in the ’70s, but then I didn’t have kids or a computer to work from home with.
Our best hope is the Swiss solution, become a low tax offshore financial enclave rather like Hong Kong… but we’re in the wrong hemisphere and banking’s fucked.
Cameron is saying and doing the right thing. Anyone who votes UKIP is just helping the Labour Party.
If Cameron took notice of why people will choose to vote UKIP and took a similar stance, those voters would probably choose the conservatives instead of the UKIP. If he took the good parts of the BNP and UKIP’s future polices he can guarantee a even bigger wedge of the votes.
Correct. UKIP has served its purpose. Cameron has made it clear what he will do if elected prior to full ratification by all signatories to Lisbon. The fact remains that the Treaty is not yet in force. How can he say more at the present time. Brussels has been put on notice and millions of Europeans are hoping that Cameron will act to pull the emergency brake and put an end, once and for all, to the concept of a superstate.
More people voted UKIP than voted labour only 4 months ago. There was a very powerful reason for that. It was a very BIG message to Cameron. Defend and protect our democracy, our historic justice system and our “independence” or we will do our darndest to put UKIP in power and that means getting as many of the people who are disgusted with the top three parties to vote UKIP as possible.
As for numbers, there are more of us, than there are labour, conservative and liberal combined!
why would people vote UKIP to send Cameron a message ? Don’t they vote UKIP because of your policies ?
at least they have some
presumably they didn’t have to steal them from the B&P like Labour then ?
who gives a fuck about Labours policies
they aren’t going to win
nor are UKIP
I explain UKIP to people I know like this (The reason I voted for them):
You can vote for who you like once our sovereignty has been re-established. You can vote Labour for all I care but unless we are governed domestically by the will of our people we will live in a facist dictatorship. The next General Election is our last chance for you or your children to have a vote for a choice of party in the future. Vote UKIP next election vote for who you would like to govern us after that. And I suspect that UKIP would be willing to hold another general election soon after establishing our sovereignty back.
I agree with most of that , but UKIP will not have served its purpose until the UK is out of the EU.
Correct.
Vote Tory or get Brown. It’s the only game in town.
There will be, despite Mr’s H’s objections, a
NON à TONY BLAIR
poster going in the back window of the wheels tomorrow!
YES! Go get him Old Nick, I shall be wearing a t shirt all summer with STOP BLAIR… on the back….and possibly on the front too!
Sorry meant all winter, but on my coat, not on my t shirt!!! Forgot winter’s coming!
Watch out — at a Countryside Alliance stall at the CLA Game Fair the ‘Bollocks to Blair’ T-shirts were confiscated.
That was against the law!
Confiscated by whom using which powers?
The police… ‘confiscating material liable to cause a breach of the peace’. I think it was just before the hunting ban vote in 2004/5.
A debate, an election and a referendum. I’m selling my gold and investing in popcorn.
Brown’s tried that already.
He invests in poppycock.
Where do you get t’em t’ings?
Your local sex shop.
Plenty of Labour and UKIP trolls on here today looking to shit stir against the Tories.
Give up boys. There’ll be a Tory landslide next May. A huge majority of voters are determined to kick psycho Brown and his gang of trurds into orbit and they know that it’s only a vote for the Tories that will achieve that.
Turds mate, TURDS.
that is intelligent debate from the deluded tory.
I was correcting his spelling, numbnutz.
How did you know my nuts are numb?
Spooky!
I don’t doubt that the Tories will get in. But I don’t trust them either. Talk means nothing, especially with an election at stake. I’ll wait for actions, and make my judgement on Dave then. Meanwhile I’ll go with my gut instinct, which is that Dave is a bellend.
The reason UKIP is gaining strength is that a Cameron victory, (landslide or otherwise) will be utterly and completely irrelevant under the appointed dictator PRESIDENT BLAIR. Post Lisbon, when 90%+ of the laws affecting us will be created in Brussels by the EU commission, the council of Ministers and the 3,500 secret working groups, Cameron will have NO POWER!
WHAT WILL BE THE POINT OF PRIME MINISTER CAMERON IF HE HAS NO POWER UNDER A BLAIR DICTATORSHIP???
COME ON TORIES, ANSWER THAT!!!
IF the outcome of the next election actually meant that the Prime Minister REALLY had the power to change things any more, Then fair enough, Cameron is a MASSIVE improvement over Brown.
instead he will at best be having to “try to negotiate in our favour in the council of ministers and if they decide against us, then TOUGH! And remember, the EU does NOT have a history of decisions taken that benefit Britain. In fact they think of the UK as a cash cow to be bled dry!
People are not supporting UKIP, for fun. Tories especially know and fully realise that removing support for the tories in large numbers will risk a labour victory and there is NOT ONE tory who would ever do that for a laugh.
The fact is, Many UKIP supporters dearly would love to see Cameron win and be in power and put things right and start to rebuild this country, BUT he cannot do that IF Lisbon passes. It would enshrine the discredited and failed politics of nulabour onto us via Brussels in laws that supercede and take precidence and priority over our own and in the sinister and sickening form of Dictator Blair!
UKIP are the only mainstream party that realise this. (mainstream insofar as they had greater popular support than the governing party at the last national election)
UKIP would not have ANY support IF Cameron would do what we know is necessary. It is highly worrying that he seems to still want to remain in Europe and run by Europe, for the current status quo will no longer be an option after Lisbon.
Conservative supporters will be desperately disappointed if He wins post Lisbon. For he will effectively have to ask for Blair’s permission for every reform.
So, Come on tories, WHAT WOULD BE THE FUCKING POINT?
My sentiments entirely Mr Ned. In the meantime folk will donate and walk the walk for UKIP. Now more than ever after Ireland.
Why don’t you put your name to it Dave?
David Cameron is taking the correct approach. The Labour spin machine wants to disrupt the Conservative conference and its easiest, and laziest, way is to do the old ‘split on Europe’ thing.
By being clear about general policy up front and not being lured into making statements about what he may do if certain possibilities happen he is taking away much of their potential to disrupt.
This sort of thinking is exactly what you want to see from a leader. Pragmatic and smart.
Absolutely cracking move by Cameron, another labour fox blown to smithereens !
Note to board ukip troll , get over it , put your toys back in the pram and help us annihilate labour.
If all UKIP voters from the last election had voted Tory we might not have had a Labour govt and therefore no LIsbon.
All those votes for UKIP did a lot of good eh?
This is a very true and salient point.
nope it’s bullshit
We are about to have a Tory government AND the Lisbon Pact, and that is exactly what Cameron intended. It is why The Guardian got him elected.
The Vast majority of Tory members oppose Cameron’s position on the Lisbon Treaty
these little party drones will sell us out to the EU pricks
I Cameron does this one thing, he is up there with, Nelson, Drake, Churchill the lot of them.
Even if he fucks up everything else he does in his Preniership, you know a bit like Jonah.
Cameron stand and fight for the British people for fuck sake.
W.W.
What i can never understand about Eurofanatics is this,why, if the Euro project and intergration is such a good idea,do they have to lie so much and are so against the people having referendums.Surely if the product was good it would sell itself.
We don’t lie. It’s the fanatical opposition that do that.
You have ZERO moral authority, in order to push this through your having to ignore the opinions of the British electorate.
It’s pathetic, how can you even begin to defend the lack of a referendum? Your forcing it through with complete contempt for the rest of us.
You and your ilk are quietly busy hammering another nail in to democracy and liberty.
Oh, and your also the reason the likes of the B&P are on the rise but that’s another rant.
Well that’s a lie straight away.
You are misinformed madam. In the euros, Labour lost more votes to UKIP and BNP than switched to the Tories. the Tory vote increased across the board by 3-4% over the previous Euros. Labour were down 15-20 % and the LibDems got a shock too
Who are “we”.
We are………………………………………………….
Not really.
I am no fan of the European project and would welcome a referendum for that reason. The problem is that all systems of government are pretty rubbish, the ideal is just to find the least bad.
I can’t imagine that we would get a ‘Yes’ vote for Westminster, or for a PR based system, or an American style system etc. etc.
Urgent. Calling the ESDF, here’s one who must be ‘dealt with’ under the terms of the Lisbon Treaty immediately.
Look’s like the only way to get out for the EUSSR is UKIP or the soon to be ERA
You mean the party that shares 14% of ‘other parties’ in opinion polls.
14% is about the vote that Yes would get in Britain if we were given a vote on the Lisbore treaty/consitution.
What the same UKIP which has helped keep NuLab in power for the last 2 elections ? Yeah right.
Well if the tory’s got off there ass’s and get us out off the hell hole that is the EUSSR there would be no need for ukip party would there
And one more thing i will not bow to the EU in any way shape your form and to any party that think i is a good idear
i will not pay tax’s to the eu
i will not figth for the eu (when russia attack’s and thay will sooner or later)
Cameron Brown clegg are all traitors…. i hope to god that the ERA form soon and take them out
You already do…it’s known as VAT. In theory it goes to Brussels and then minus the contribution less any rebate is returned.
UKIP is Mandy’s way of keeping down tory votes in marginal constituencies.
At the last GE there were about 30 constituencies where UKIP let a labour MP hold the seat.
If Browns majority had been 36 and not 66 we might have had a referendum as the difference could have been overturned by eurosceptic Labour MPS – and yes there are some. So while you’re moaning today about the Irish, remember UKIP played its part in getting us here.
That’s why the cons are allied with B&P in alot of councils.
Your mendacity is exceeded only by your brevity.
true conservatives won’t stand by and watch a lightweight like mr cameron give away Britiain’s Sovereignity
if he has to be ‘corrected’ he will be
the conservative party is overwhelmingly eurosceptic and will make mr cameron listen and act sooner or later
resurgemus
At the last GE there were about 30 constituencies where UKIP let a labour MP hold the seat… yep
And i hope that in the next GE ukip stop the tory’s geting more seat’s
ALL CAMSHIT has to do to win the next GE hand’s down is GIVE US A VOTE ON THE EU …..if he give a free vote on the eu ill vote for him if he don’t there is not a GOD’S HOPE IN HELL ILL VOTE TORY
love the logic.
Hate to point it out but if Cameron doesn’t win the election you have Zero chance of a referendum with with Lib\Lab; and a much faster route of integration to the greater Union.
Your pitch seems to be unless Cameron goes to the country on your terms you’ll enable a government which does exactly what you don’t want to happen.
Hate to point it out but there’s no point in being elected if everything you do is dictated by a corrupt E.U. as it will be under lisbon
you keep spinning the party line like a good little drone and see how much good it does you under E.U. President Blair
so if there’s no point voting I assume UKIP won’t be wasting people’s time by putting up candidates ?
Does anyone think that once Blair is appointed as dictator of Europe, with all the increased power and influence that will be bestowed, that he will ever allow Cameron’s tories to dismantle the nulabour disaster in our country?
You can vote tory to get rid of Brown, but can you vote tory to get rid of nulabour if dictator Blair has got more power than any national leader?
so why will he allow you to do it if he won’t allow anyone else ?
In that case you will deserve everything coming your way when labour win
A pro EU tory party will be utterly and completely irrelevant under dictator Blair as the EU President, dontcha think?
You really expect a libertarian conservative like myself to vote to have the tories acting as Blair’s poodles in Westminster?
If he grew some balls, then he might be worthy of a vote, but what is the point of having Cameron as Prime Minister of the UK, when Dictator Blair will be enforcing nulabour politics on us from Brussels? That would be incredibly humiliating.
The fact is, that WHOEVER wins the 2010 UK general election will be subservient to a POST LISBON reality.
On the BIG issues, Cameron OR BROWN would have to follow the EU diktats regardless of what they, their parties or the country wants.
That is why voting only for parties that would have the balls to take THE decision to get us OUT of the EU altogether, is the essential first step to actually sorting out the vast pile of shit that 12 years of Blair/Brown has gotten us into!
IF the Lisbon treaty is finally ratified throughout the EU and IF Cameron then announces that his “not letting the matter rest there” would be an explicit promise of a referendum on the EU Membership, then he would deserve to win a landslide and UKIP and the BritnatsP would be sunk instantly.
As it is, it will not make a shite of difference if Brown wins over Cameron, because President Dictator Blair will be calling the shots in this country.
so if it’s all pointless UKIP will only be contesting seats to get their share of the pork-barrel ?
That rates a “well DUH!”
UKIP want’s us OUT of the pork-barrel They are the only mainstream party that do, and ONCE THE FRAUD OF THE OPINION POLLS is known, and those people who believe that voting UKIP would be a wasted vote, because only the tories or labour have the number of votes to win, and they realise that there are many times more people in this country thinking EXACTLY LIKE THEM than there are that will vote tory and labour COMBINED, then UKIP could easily win!
but you’ve just said we’re in a union and nothing can be changed and that voting is pointless. And if it’s all fixed as you claim then how would you know if you’d won ?
Or is it perhaps worth voting after all ?
”They are the only mainstream party that do”
Cept the toytown nazis who also have been around longer than flash in the pan UKIP.
worth voting for somone with guts who will abrogate this lisbon filth
cameron still has a chance to listen to the majority of conservaties telling him that this is one of the most important decisions in decades and the referendum is not an optional extra
if he keeps this lightweight wimp act up he’s going to reap the whirlwind
Can anyone explain why Margaret a Beckett stated on 4news yesterday afternoon that the UK didn’t run on Referendums, and the State had no mechanisms to organise one!
This was in response to the question of why Labour never held an R 4 EU as promised in their Manifesto.
1) Why bother putting it in a Manifesto?
2) Why did Brown promise a referendum on PR?
3) How can Cameron hold one as promised?
Or was she lying?
She’s talking tosh
A Labour minister lying?
Is a pig’s arse pork?
Its all just a game of Backgammon.
Be fair to Margaret. She wouldn’t know whether she was uttering a falsehood or not.
Yeah, Gordon promised a referendum and said it would be put into the Labour election manifesto (laugh), wasn’t Margaret listening? and we all believe Labour manifesto promises now don’t we.
Probably not lying. You have to bear in mind Margaret Beckett was never very bright. Her grasp of constitutional issues and legislation has always been poor at best.
Don’t forget she was the worst Foreign Secretary this country ever had ( yes even worse than Militwit). She was so bad that Foreign Office officials sad she needed a training course to help her cope with her job.
Talking right out of her backside….
Just like the State had no mechanisms to give devolution to Scotland and give Wales an assembly? Absolute nonsense
So what does, ‘We will not let matters rest there’ mean? Does it mean if it is ratified Cameron won’t accept it and pull out?
NO
Shouldnt that be Nein or Non.
So what does it mean? Because as we approach the election next spring, If we are under the rule of a dictator Blair, you can bet your life that UKIP might not win, but they will take enough votes off the tories to ensure a Brown victory IF Cameron keeps us in an EU run by Blair!
So vote UKIP to keep the man who signed the Lisbon treaty in power !
Which Blair ?
The original or the heir to blair clone ?
Nigel Farage calling foul, foul on Irish TV, predictably, all too predictable
Nice retort – what’s Ukip doing in Irish politics – we Irish won’t be bullied.
It is European politics.
Trumpeter…. don’t you understand? “Irish” politics no longer exists.
Wrong again my friend-the Irish have been bullied -into having another vote.The previous vote didnt count because it wasnt the right result for the EuroNazis
So what are all the European politicians and bureaucrats doing over there?
Gone to kiss the Blarney Stone?
God, I hope so.
The chap who holds onto you while you lean over might just lose his grip.
Really?
The vote results show that you can be bullied and easily. For years you fought for independance and then throw it away by giving it to the EU..
The result should be a resounding NO if you won’t be bullied
“we Irish won’t be bullied”
ROFLMFAO!!!! Not Bullied???? BULLSHIT YOU PANSYWANK PUSSY!
The Irish voted YES to Lisbon, because you have been bullied by the EU you IRISH pussy!
You are are bunch of cowardly wimpish pussies that are a disgrace to your very proud ancestors!
You have just completely given away all the independence your ancestors fought the British for. You gave it away for NOTHING in return and to add insult to injury, you have given it away to be ruled over by the BRITISH DICTATOR BLAIR, YOU FUCKING FUCKWIT IDIOTS!
ALL those deaths to win independence from the British for NOTHING!
This post is unfair to pussies.
When push comes to shove you can never rely on our “friends” from the Emerald Isle.
Do us all a favour – keep the slimy little toerag. I assume he is in Ireland because he has found some angle which lets him claim extra expenses from Strasbourg.
Very funny
“If the World had listened to us” (Me). I knew this was going to happen ten years ago so I sat back and let it happen. Time to lock the madman up and throw away the key.
Best of luck to the no voters in free Ireland.
Also cummon Fawkes where are insights into the Waffen SS links. Get Pickles on to justify himself right now.
why not ask Lembit Opik – I believe he may have better connections
GIVEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE MEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE AAAAAAAAAAAA VOTEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
Got any Es goin’ spare?
O/T Sorry. So gordon has now said that he will take part in the TV Debates .
Oh wait a minute! No! He has said apparently that he he will debate with Cameron but not with Clegg , although he might agree at a later date to debate with Clegg on his own. And he is saying the debates must be on topics which he agrees.
Good stalling tactic gordon , make it look as though you are being cooperative and then keep putting spokes in the wheel. How very typical.
He has agreed “in principle”. In other words he has no intention unless Nick Robinson hosts the debate, all questions are pre-approved by him and that Cameron promises not to be beastly to him.
Yarroo!, geroff!, is the tuck shop still open?
Hello Chums! Any pies left for me?
Oh and Cameron is not allowed to answer any questions, other than “You really are a cannibis smoking, poor hating, bullingdon club toff aren’t you?” and he MUST answer that in the positive. He will be free to answer in any way he likes, so long as it is “yes”, “affirmative” or “I am proud to screw all the British poor and middle class to exclusively enrich my toff friends”
I am sure that Gordon will be very satisfied with those terms.
Cammo needs a radio feed to Dan Hannon in his jacket’s mobile pocket — or Richard Starkey.
It won’t happen. Salvator mundi is too frit.
Galloway eviscerates Gordon Brown
“A smile like the brass plate on the lid of a coffin”
Takes one to know one as they say, what’s it today George, pretend to be something other than a complete pillock.
Originally said of Robert Peel in the 1840′s. (A-Level History used to be something you remember for life).
With the paddy’s surrendering their sovereignty can we assume that the raft or “irish” pubs spanning the globe will be replaced with Euro Bars, gone will be the leprechauns replaced with pictures of there most masterful leader Tony Blair….
Crickey, what a thought – what will Sinn Fein say when they discover the republic is governed by a Brit……
hahahahaha love it!!! And the fact that they will have to kow tow, cap in hand to him for subsidies when the potato crop fails….
Sinn Gein campaigned tirelessly against the Lisbon reform treaty for that reason as much as any other I believe.
But it is a very sad, depressing and rage inducing irony, that the Irish idiots have just voted to give away their vestage of very hard fought independence to the EU to be ruled over by BLAIR!
I cannot adequately express my utter outrage, hatred and loathing of the Irish cowards and traitors now.
They are a fucking disgrace of a nation. pathetic, cowardly and utterly supine. Bastards all!
Apart from those who voted no perhaps?
bang
THE GAME’S UP !!!!!!!!!
That’s right “Dave” , give them enough warning so they know they have to rush it through and then you won’t have to give us a referendum
Answer me, fellow posters, if you would be so kind:
Which UK part most fits a person who despises NuLabour but believes in libertarianism, a free market and low taxation but who *also* really enjoys Europe, its people, culture, transport, education standards etc etc. (and is thinking of emigrating to France)?!
surely there has to be a space in the Tory party for such thoughts? Or would these be forbidden under Dave?
I think you are allowed to ‘like France’ in the Conservative Party aren’t you?
A third of it belongs to us, after all. There is a lot of difference between liking people and being shacked to them.
Shackled.
Of course, it is possible to like ANY country one wishes, and emmigrate to any country. That does not mean that we should accept being ruled by any other country or be subservient to any other country.
There is much about Europe I love with a passion, but I hate the coming EU dictatorship just as much.
Love Europe, hate the EU.
A good slogan for a t-shirt me thinks.
HATE the EU, LOVE EUROPE!
No. There is no contradiction. All European countries have strengths but they have weaknesses, too. There is nothing incompatible with enjoying life and respecting achievement where ever it is to be found.
I find socialism to be morally abhorrent and intellectually dishonest. So do many ‘Europeans’ I know.
UKIP
I am hoping, I am praying almost, that The Lad Dave has grown an enormous pair. That his advisors have been taking the temperature among ordinary people (though the idea of Zac Goldsmith chatting to workers in the street does stretch the imagination a little too far) and that they realise the strength of feeling out there.
It’s not so much about Europe; though that is bad enough, it’s about being totally taken for granted by the ruling elite, about decisions being made over which we have absolutely no say, and, above all about integrity and political honesty.
So, Dave, size ten boots on and kick some ass….are you up to it? Or will you be kissing it instead?
We the undersigned petition the Prime Minister to have a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty.
http://petitions.number10.gov.uk/Lisbon-ref/
what is the FUCKING POINT of tghis petition??? Brown has already SIGNED the fucking treaty and deposited it AT ROME!!!
There is no way in hell he is going to have a referendum on it!
Besides, when has he EVER taken note of one of the number 10 petitions? They are an utter waste of time and energy.
He said he was sorry about the way Alan Turin was treated. Seems quite happy to apologise for things he wasn’t responsible for, but not for things which he is responsible.
I’ve already signed the one asking him to resign and he hasn’t done it so I can’t be arsed with this one sorry.
Conservative Conference coming up next week.
Expect gordon to discover another uncharacteristic surge of concern for our troops in Afghanistan and be making another flying visit out there Tuesday or Wednesday in a bid to grab the headlines.
Nell – you ARE a cynic !!
More likely is election time!
12 years of a labour government would make a saint a cynic !!
We can only hope he puts his massive foot in his mouth, insults a few more troops and storms off into the wastelands in a huff. Never to come back
Our Prime Minister will be engaged on a “fact finding mission” ahead of further troop deployments.It is PURELY co-incidental that the only window in his diary was next week. Labour will say that you cannot play politics with our armed forces and if the media choose to accompany Mr Brown and happen to have one or photographs of him addressing the troops well that again is pure co-incidence
He’ll probably spend a lot of time with the Taliban learning how to be an insurgent.
What’s that? All operations to be suspended until Saturday 10th October? Yes Bob.
Ed Balls is a wanker you could never tire of punching.
Bloody hell, pity the girl in the chair wasnt a bit stronger. Should have been telling the Ballster to shut the fuck up.
The man is a complete and utter Huhne. IDS did well to keep his temper. I’d have leaned over and smacked the Huhne in the chops.
I should have said the Afghan visit doesn’t kick off until 2:30
Balls by name, Balls by nature.
only Allah can save you all now.
ALLAH ACKBAR
Who he?
Alan Ackbar is a new winger for Villa I think.
No, he’s a playwright.
Plays up front for Chelsea, quick feet for a big man.
Vaclav Klaus is a brilliant pol, despite holding a PhD in history a la that of McBroon.
It’s ‘SWING’ Saturday in Ireland on an increased turnout. Ireland once again at the heart of Europe.
And proving themselves to be utterly subservient slaves to it! Cowards and bastards all of ‘em.
Here, Here!!!
When we’re out of the EU you can have all your caravans back with our love — hell we’ll even help you out by laying on extra ferries…
Adolf Hitler had some good ideas which we can impose now the little Irish problem has been overcome.I have it on good authority that in some areas the yes vote was running at over 150% and you dont get that level of support without a lot of hard work.
This is a victory for the elite and when the treaty is finally ratified fully the plebs will not be able to express any opinions on the EU project, El Presidente Blair or Lady Slot gob without facing the firing squad.
For you tommies the war is over.
The “Doomsday Scenario” seems to have rather played well in Eire!! No more euro subsidies for a second “No” Vote
That’s why they’ve been so stupid… they’d have got far more subsidies if they’d said no again. Do you really think the EU would have given up?
Václav Klaus – corrupt and homophobic, just the kind of friend Cameron needs.
Mc Brown is corrupt and homosexual.
Homophobic you say?
GOOD! The man just get more likeable by the day.
Be nice to him, for god’s sake!
He’s also unelected
sweet delicious irony
and he understands science, and utterly disagrees with the completely unproven AGW theory too. The guy has suffered under communism and survived to tell the tale.
He recognises the same evil in the heart of the EU too.
Haven’t you forgotten the antisemitic slur, like the one Minibrain was throwing at the Latvians?
Good for him
Gordon Brown is highly predictable.
I am surprised that nobody had noticed that within half an hour or so of the Irish results coming through, Brown suddenly says he will do a debate. Now Call me a cynic but I am of the opinion Brown will be going to the palace on Monday to call a general election for 22nd October 2009! 17 days are required from Dissolution of Parliament to Polling day I believe!
This European issue is just what Brown has been waiting for in terms of the final piece in place. Labour know they are going to lose but their hope is the European issue will cause the Tories to talk on Europe and help the Soft LD> Tory swing voters get put off by the subject of Europe and thus back the LD European surrender monkeys!
I simply dont believe the co-incidence of Alistair Campbell working for Labour, Labour MPs canvasing 3 nights a week and on a Saturday, minimum wage and certain benifit increases:Brown said in his speech ‘this month’, it was in september! Along with the car scrappage scheme being extended in terms of numbers but not duration. Very much looks to me as Brown is going to do the ultimate trying to destabilise the Tories and call the election on Monday! He has nothing to lose you see – If this means the Tories dont get a majority Brown will do it. If the Tories are deprived a majority I will be surprised if the stamped at the airports wont be of great media interest in itself!
No doubt Brown will try and use it as a dividing line on europe. Brown is so shit!
Nope Brown would not dare. So long as Klaus in the Czech Republic has not ratified, then Cameron could win by promising a referendum on the Treaty. That would be enough for a win.
Once the treaty is ratified everywhere, then only offering a referendum on membership of the EU dictatorship itself, would be enough to secure a victory.
The only reason Brown was not deposed in the summer was Mandelson’s need to have him limp on to the very last possible moment and give them time to ensure Blair’s coronation in the EU. Labour know that the minute they replace the leader they’d be pressured into an immediate GE. Mandy is not daft, he knows his pet project is over. Brown is his puppet.
Mandelson is running the show to ensure Blair (notable by his absence on the world stage at present) is installed as the EU President. To this end he needed the Irish to ratify and as much time as possible to get the Czechs and Poles to ratify as he can muster.
Mandelson knows the game is up. Party over. But of course he’s moved onto dreaming of bigger things. Blair in control of the whole of the EU and no doubt key positions back in the EU (after the carnage of the June GE leaves the NuLabour project in tatters) for Blair’s favourites and key henchmen, Mandy included.
Brown will be the fall guy and the NuLabour project will have served it’s course. Meanwhile Blair will oppose everything Dave does to reverse the last 12 years of shame thus making a new Conservative Government work within a constricted legislative environment regardless of the size of their Westminster majority.
Will we ever be rid of Blair and Mandelson’s destruction of this country? Bastards!
I hate ‘Europe’.
call a general election for 22nd October ”
OMG! The sassenachs are daydreaming again!
Look Martin, I will remind you lot of poncy morris dancers one last time-Herr Broon will cling on by his fingernails (or whats left of them) until the last possible moment-and beyond, if the twat could!
You lot live in fantasy land down there-first, you have been dreaming of coups against the dictator for the last couple of years-which came to nowt!
You are now wildly speculating-without a shred of evidence-that Broon will go early!
You speculate about his nokia throwing and ill health-again without a shred of clear evidence, to seemingly back up your case for his early demise!
Broon has got his party and at least a quarter of his countrymen in his thrall-for many reasons-the main one being the media and police as his lapdogs!
Add to the above the fact that the poor misguided sods who live down there and vote libdum. are consigning your land to at least a further 5 years dictatorship when the dums join forces with liebour to give Bean the mandate to rule he craves!
Thank god, when that happens, this so called “union” will be consigned to the dustbin of history where it belongs
Tata the noo!
So Brown will kill the European Union ?
Please take all your scumbags with you when you leave the UK.
I hate Gordon and I hate Europe!
But it actually makes me feel better hating Gordon Brown, so he does have a use after all!!!
I despise him, really i do – I would really love to torture him once he is booted out of office! Lets get out of the EU and also get out of the non torture protocol! Just imagine the pain and degredation he would suffer with drills, sledge hammers and food mixers! I would of course save the electric wisk for Peter Mandelson! Dont think he will be smiling then! Battered round the ring would mean a whole new range of jokes!
I believe you are right there. Labour are relying on a split UKIP/Tory vote for their hung Parliament/Lib/Lab pact…
The 29th you say? Wouldn’t be surprised.
In the history of our people the year 2009 will be a great, incomparable, proud year…. Later historians will show that the EU found its way back again to the position of an honourable state- that our history has once more become a worthy history. . .
Hat Tip A Hitler
My great plan has finally come to fruition without a shot being fired.
I think Tony would make a great President.
un glipollas integral
Stealth succeeds where force failed.
And you relied on the cowardly Irish to deliver.
Little person of the EUSSR, be under no illusions. You legitimise OUR power by your very existence – that is the only power you have left.
[...] Guido: I want to make one thing clear: there will be no change in our policy on Europe and no new [...]
Time to bring back the Black and Tans
They knew how to deal with the mick, re- forming the B specials in the North would also be a good idea.
The Bog Trotters have always been reliable backstabbers
Too late mate, I think we have already been sold down the river!
bribing polititians was cheap in those days, this treason was secured for a plastic boat and a crew of fit young weekend matelots.
we’ve somehow got to stop old closet queens from taking such positions of power, they are all too easily compromised and then manipulated.
Agree with the message but use a spellchecker, eh boys. “Beyound…”
Knob end.
We should embrace Europe. Nonetheless Blair should NOT be Euro pres.
I wouldn’t mind the job and persuade the good people of this country Europe is a good idea.
I don’t want a European President.
However, I really don’t want Blair to be European President. It’s time to remind our Eiuropean cousins of all his lies and his friendship with Bush.
IF the EU needs a president, he or she should be elected by the people and NOT imposed as a dictator.
The EU is EVIL!
so if the Czechs can hold out long enough to get Brown out and a GE called toot sweet, Then Cameron can get us a referendum and we can kick the EUSSR thing to it’s death ?
Any wonder then that Labour defrost Brown every day and wheel him out for another kicking ? it takes the public eye off the clock, if they cling on there long enough, the trap door clangs shut forever.
The race is now on and the Euro-Kommisars will move heaven and earth to get the Czechs on board…..stand by for massive amounts of euro cash being temorarilly diverted away from Olive growers to bribing the Czechs to give the “right result”.
Then Dave can claim tough luck, it’s already in place, we have to live with it and be renamed sector13, Eurostate.
actually, if you live in the south of England, the region will be called Transmanche and will extend to mid France and be administered in Paris.
I live in the Western Europe region that extends down the west coast of Europe to Portugal.
Nation states are to be eliminated, replaced by loads of regions that span the old national borders.
We really need to get the word out and get a referendum on withdrawal from this evil EU dictatorship completely!
Indeed, so vote UKIP
Vive la difference!
October 29th-30th The European Council and Klaus caves
Brave little Poland stood up to tyranny 20 years ago and won, I think brave Poland will stand up to Lisbon and President Blair.
If Cameron is really anti-EUSSR, he should strike up strong friendships with other countries like the Poles and the Czechs while working on how to avoid the Supreme Court from issuing a diktat that might forbid a referendum and deciding that the Lisbon Treaty is irrevocable.
Yes but he’s got Ken Clarke whispering in his lughole, doing a Ted Heath, telling him how wonderful europe is, how it’s not really a superstate, and nothing to do with laws, it’s just a trading agreement…really…it is…ask our fishermen….
Meanwhile dictator Blair will be vetoing all the measures that Cameron will use to try to repair the Blair/Brown nulabour disasters.
What would be the point of PM Cameron if Dictator Blair is in power?
Maybe you should write and ask Mrs Windsor what she’s doing about it.
she’s a figurehead, much like dave will be under Blair
actually she could dissolve parliament if she wanted to
no, she couldn’t
she’s smart enough not to get involved in party politics and even dave isn’t crazy enough to think she ever should or would without the request by a PM to do so
She’s head of state and has the power to do so.
That she chooses not to is her decision.
Cameron would be Prime Minister and would have the power to call a referendum and abrogate Lisbon regardless of ratification.
That he chooses not to is his decision.
no, she couldn’t
Yes she can.
I cannot find any statute that says she cannot do so off her own bat. She is *generally* asked to d so b the PM, but I can’t find anything that says, in law, she cannot do so herself.
There is *convention*, but so what?
Derry and the Blairs are strong allies, with Blair as the EU President and Derry’s Supreme Court of all things constitutional, (with Mrs Blair “going in between”) any political party is going to have it’s work cut out to extricate the Country from this tar pit.
I’d like to see ‘with Mrs Blair “going in between. Bag over the head she’d be a super sandwich maker.
AH (C)
What ho! let’s keep this Euro piffle-paffle under lock and key what ?
No use letting the little people know it’s a done deal and spoiling all the Conference freebies and beanos with their yapping about the death of Democracy.
Tell you what, if you can spin it that Dave’s wearing his angry frowny face over lisbon I can guarantee some of the best nosh and cocktail parties around the fringe and maybe even get you some face time with a Cabinet member or two.
Coulson will email you the invites and details old fruit.
Pip Pip!
Did you know that Tony Blair, Ruth Kelly, Ed Balls, Harriett Harman, Charles Clarke and Alastair Darling were all educated at Public Schools, and within the labour parliamentary party there are many more?
So what ?
So was I and I hate Labour in today’s guise, really & truly hate them and what they’ve done to us.
Yes. That’s why all that Tory Toff/Gideon/Bullingdon class war stuff is such utterly dishonest bullshit.
way to miss the point
some folk here need a big flashing sign and everything spelled out to them a letter at a time
Who?
UKIP
that’s why its titles are all letters
Heir-to-Blair
that’s why Camerons a pussy
What? You haven’t said anything, let alone spell it out.
Nell, for the umpteenth time, ‘it’s’ got nothing to do with people being educated at public schools. It’s to do with the people themselves. You could point a finger at those educated at comprehensive schools, as with the others – some are good, some bad.
You’ll have to join Galloway if you want to go down that road. He missuses his intellect by being horribly prejudiced, and showing up the enormous chip he has.
As I said, Contessa, the point about them having been at public schools is that it highlights their dishonesty in playing the class game. It doesn’t make them bad people, they just happen to be bad anyway.
I have followed your witticism with much amusement for some time but it saddens me to have call you all a bunch of fucking wankers. Ten years ago we had a chance of becoming main stream in Europe. Not now, the die is cast no matter what happens treaty wise . England shuffles off to become a cross between Portugal and Belgium plus a dash of Isle of Mann. This is the course that now is set for us.
Note for kids with useful degree, learn Spanish and get out of the UK. English/ Spanish near all the world covered.
The UK blazer set will only need you to tend to their golf greens.
No we fucking didn’t, if you think even for one miserable second that the french and germans would ever have allowed us, ten years ago, to be “mainstream” you are one sad, deluded individual.
I’m waiting for the see the results of the next GE and see if all is lost before I get the family out.
Let’s get out as soon as possible!
Any chance of any arguments to support your theory/abuse? Or is that too much to ask for?
Not you, Ratsniffer, the idiot above you.
BULLSHIT, the EU only ever saw us as a cash-cow. I have a good friend, (I was the best man at his wedding) who was very Pro EU (as was I 16 years ago) and he moved to strassbourg to work in the very heart of the beast. He has come out totally dissolusioned and scarred. He knows that the UK is seen purely as a cash-cow full of useful idiots.
He still believes in what he thought the EU was supposed to be. It is no longer that wonderful institution with great promise. It is set to be a dictatorship along a Marxist Fascist model. Big Business hand in hand with the Oligarchy all supporting a dictator. No elections for anything of value or democratic worth. Parliament is an advisory body that can be over-ruled.
It is only their to give the most tiny fig-leaf of democracy. In reality it is a defacto dictatorship.
You really want Britain to be consumed by such a marxist-faschist dictatorship? If so you arte a twat!
You poor deluded stupid little fuck. After everything we have given up, all the money we gave.Do you realy think that France wouldn’t allways run the EU.
We would never be main stream not while the French President had a hole in his arse.Go back and look at the history of the EU,you cock.
You haven’t studied much history, have you, An Englishman in Retreat?
England, and later Britain, has played a significant part in European history for 1000 years. Our military interventions, our economic influence (first wool, then manufactured goods) and our intellectual might (after the Restoration of the Monarchy in the 17th century) have often been decisive in Europe, and mostly for the better. We did this as a free, independent nation.
History is a great teacher. Independence is hard-won, easily surrendered, and intensely precious.
He’d have a point if he’d been talking about the formation of the common market back in the 50′s when the LABOUR government declined to become members (on the basis the Durham miners wouldn’t like it),
If we’d been in at the start, when Germany was split in two and France a war torn wreck we could have dictated terms and built it as a free trade zone and little else. We’d have probably been able to negotiate the Commonwealth access as well.
Instead we didn’t we sat on our hands and a distinctly French style of organisation was created. I don’t want to be shackled to that as it goes down.
What amuses me is the introspective little Europeans who support the EU project, there’s a whole world out there you know!
Blair will use his position as EU president to subvert any attempt of Cameron’s to wind back the Pee Cee Euroclock and unpick all the stupid legislation that has dogged our legal system and stiffled debate in this country.
Oh and he will also force us to accept the schengen agreement, meaning our boders will be forever open. Remember Blair said, when he was first elected, that he wanted to “destroy the forces of conservatism for ever”, perhaps is is just dawning on the conservatives that Blair will be in an incredibly strong position to carry on trying to do just that…..together with his socialist europals….you have been warned!
IF that is what is transpiring, then the ONLY valid and rational choice at the next election will be between parties in favour of the EU dictatorship, and parties against and in favour of full withdrawl.
If the tories think that they can convince the public that they would have the power to overturn, or renegotiate the terms of Lisbon, they are clinically insane. Once Blair is dictator in chief, there is no way in hell that they will be able to re-open negotiations
the EU will have become such a massively corrupt elitists club, and the tories ain’t in it!
I think I may put a hundred on a UKIP victory at the general election. The odds must be good enough to pay off my mortgage if they win.
The tories COULD kill off UKIP instantly. But they refuse to. So, who do they support? the elitists at the top of the EU? or the people of this country, the value of democracy and the sovereignty of our sovereign Isle?
It is fast coming the time to choose.
so if the ignore Cameron beacuase he’s not in the club, why will they take any notice of UKIP ? Are you in the club ?
resurgemus-Are you able to stop pontificating and actually do something? The only way folk won’t consider voting UKIP is because of people like you.
Why don’t you help then at least you can tell others how you either tried as a patriot or failed as a victim of facist blackmail?
Because trying to scare people with bogeymen is a crap strategy ( see climate change ). you don’t have to put people like me in an anti-EU mould, you do have to put Libdems etc. there and looking at their sites today UKIP is visible by its absence.
In my constituency UKIP has let in a europhile muppet as MP at the last election – how does that help ? UKIP’s policy (since it is based on blackmailing Cameron) is to ask me to cut off my nose to spite my face.
The EU fight is unfortunately a long game not a short one. If you check on PB it is concern number 11 on people’s priorities at the moment. Also I hear the statement that we will withdraw and live ilke Norway, I doubt it will be that simple hence my feeling of a long protracted negotiation. I find UKIP’s position very much like the SNP with the UK. SNP bloggers try to create an atmosphere of hate for the english and then pretend there won’t be a backlash which will hurt Scotland.
When I see something intelligent from UKIP I’ll look at it with an open mind but to me at present getting rid of Brown is the priority and irrespective of what you think of CMD ( and I have my own questions ) he is the best chance of getting a Brown out and a better relationship with other European countries.
I do not hold to the view of now or never. European history is the story of elites ignoring the masses until there is violent change. The UK has avoided this largely through pragmatic adaption and compromise. If Euro elites think they can hold 700 million people together by ignoring them they are deluded and should look at the Ceaucescu regime to see where they are headed.
The tories are trying to kill off UKIP-can’t you see? By stalling they are attempting to drain enthusiasm & donations to UKIP. It’s all too bloody obvious to a businessman. Faux example i.e: ‘Don’t buy an Iphone ‘cos one that is 200 times better is coming out next year’. -Get it?
FIGHT AGAINST the BLIAR!
Klaus is nothing but a xenophobe, a political pigmy compared to Havel. That the next Government of the UK should be resting its political hopes on such a man is rather disturbing.
Well, you see the beauty of living in a free democracy is that you are free to express how utterly incorrect you are, and spout any old rubbish like you just did.
But under a dictatorship, that freedom ends! Are you looking forward to living under dictator Blair?
Will Cameron’s referendum be binding ?
President Blair, what a nightmarish sick joke.
No doubt the rest of the Labour incompetents & traitors will get cushy jobs in Brussels as well.
And US just announced this too:
‘ISTANBUL, Oct 3 (Reuters) – The Group of Seven rich nations hopes to decide on Saturday its future as an institution, with the United States pushing for the creation of a smaller core group, a G7 official said.
The official, speaking on condition of anonymity, said Washington wanted to see the G7 supplanted in global economic policymaking by a Group of Four that would comprise the United States, Europe, China and Japan.
For more than a decade, the G7 has dominated international policymaking. But the financial crisis has undermined its power, as big developing economies such as China have become key to managing the global recovery.’
Talk about writing on the wall.
That means we get the Blair shyte as our only rep. No thanks, a ref and now!
AH (C)
Surely this is some sick joke?!
You can see why Obama would get fed up with Brown, Sarkozy and Merkel making complete pilocks of themselves sucking up to him.
Lovely straight roads in Belgium. A fellow could get up a good head of steam, aim and let momentum do the rest.
I shall henceforth be referring to Euros as ‘Treasons’.
Japan lol don’t make me laugh, they’ll be be a part of China soon.
For some time I believed the Heseltine line that the EU would be a useful tool
to prevent another widespread war in Europe .
However,it is now clear that it will do no such thing . The bureaucrats running
the operation are nothing but re-incarnated Nazis and will take the continent into widespread conflict . This time it will be a civil war caused simply by not giving all nations a democratic vote
It won’t happen quickly, probaby not in my lifetime ,but it will happen .
Amen!
With mass muslim migration, the Euro elites are busy creating Euroarabia. This guarantees war in Europe within the next 30 years.
War in Europe has been prevented by NATO and the nuclear bomb. The EU has nothing to do with it.
So, the Irish have been bought and sold for Brussels gold. I for one will never accept Bliar as any type of president. Having been denied a vote, I plan to make my feelings known by burning an effigy of the lying, cheating, traitorous warmonger on the kids’ bonfire next month. If every bonfire in the land from John o’Groats to Land’s End were to do this it would send the scumbag and his puppetmasters in Brussels a clear message. Guy Merchandise could do ome nice business selling Blair masks. The only problem would be that the money-grubbing would-be emperor would want ‘royalties’.
Penny for the tony, guv?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/newstopics/politics/6255555/Tories-vow-to-block-Tony-Blairs-appointment-as-EU-president.html
The Tories have vowed to strongly oppose the appointment of tone as President of the EU if the Treaty gets ratified.
What I can’t understand is why merkel and sarkozy are so strongly supporting him – what’s in it for them?
They can blame the English for producing the next Hitler throughout history forevermore.
Nell, he bought and paid for it using our money.
if they don’t have the guts to stop lisbon then they won’t stop blair
We’ve got to FIGHT AGAINST BLAIR!
FANTASTIC SYMBOLISM!!!!
Penny for the tony… Great!
FIGHT AGAINST BLAIR becoming president.
way ahead of you mate, B.Liar’s image is already on my kids’ guy for November 5th, couldn’t bring myself to put Guido’s on anymore
GREAT, well done!!!!!!!!!! Hope your action is repeated all over the country!!!!!
Guido Fawkes ( the original) was a patriot. We need more of his kind today i think.
So the only nations now that can save us from The Lisbon Treaty are Poland and the Czech Republic – 2 nations whose populace would be fucking Kangaroos for 50p a time to make a living if the rest of the free world hadn’t supported them against communism. So no hope there.
These repeated referenda are perhaps the most irritating thing about the EU, repeatedly holding plebicites for the sole purpose of fatiguing the people into complying with their agenda. If we vote no, then we are told to vote again, but if we vote yes (after being coerced) then the vote is final.
Why is EU expansion somehow the “default” option and one has to justify limiting the expansion of the EU federal government, surely it should be the other way around?
Regarding the referendum on our initial admission to the EU, surely one generation has no more right to impose a system of government on future generations, than one nation upon another?
The fact that the Tories aren’t openly talking about secession is reason enough not to vote them. There can be no liberty without independence.
AMEN! again
It’s notable that UKIP and beanpea have mep’s too, enjoying the EU gravy train.
And it’s very cheap and easy for minority parties like UKIP to talk about coming out of Europe when they know that in reality they are never going to be big enough to have the power to bring such a thing about.
I could promise tomorrow that if I inherited billions of pounds I would pledge it all to save the poor – it might make me look good – it might win me an election if I chose to stand – but I know that i’m never going to have that money therefore my promise is empty, as is theirs.
Perhaps secession should be instigated by the general body politic as apposed to the politcal class?
I could promise tomorrow to have a referendum whether it’s ratified or not
so could call me Dave but that would require leadership and balls
Abrogation to protect British Sovereignity
In the absence of a referendum the next best thing which Dave or any incoming leader will easily do in about sixty years is to get a Civil Service and Local Government organisation that bats for Britain instead of the we invented fair play worshippers we’ve got running the show.
Criteria needed starts with a brain runs down a spine and ends up with balls.
1.Ability to see illegal immigrants as offenders to be booted out and not as poor souls deserving lots of our hard earned plus that house thats just become vacant.
2.Ability to ignore loopy EU regs by losing files down the back of the draw and just not geting round to it yet. You’d think the lazy bastards would at least be able to do that.
The French didn’t do this brilliantly regarding the abattoirs, which needed to be super duper, luxery, carpets and piped music, remember? Good old UK excelled itself and managed to shut dozens down. Froggies turned a blind eye and still have loads.
3.Bit of pride. Froggies again. Germans didn’t like something on a Frogmobile a few years back [quelle surprise] so they couldn’t be sold in Germany. Suddenly big problem with registration of VWs into France. Result? Frogmobile suddenly AOK mien heir.
4.Sense of what is required for security. Do you see French utility companies open to foreign ownership? German ones? No. They have a sensible interpretation of the rules.
5. Sense of kinship. Did the Germans and French open their borders to unlimited numbers cheap workers from the newly joined countries?
I don’t like the majority of EU output, but I like our feeble adoption roll over approach far less.
yup our bureuacrats are crap and can’t play the game
could add to your list
- lose records of VAT receipts so less handed over
- errors on claims from Brussels so we are overpaid a l’italienne
- delays in payments to Brussels when negotiating at key conferences
too much naivety in our civil service
Looks like the Party line isn’t holding as Hannan seems to be hinting that a referendum regardless of ratification is essential
I think wider referendum is pretty obviously code for in or out
It is depressing news to hear how the Irish referendum is going. Here’s hoping that the Czechs can do something about it. I some how doubt it. The federalist agenda is back on the EU’s menu. This also means President Blair will make a come back. I hate to think what other “justifiable wars” he will try and get the EU to be involved in. Do you think Blair will try and force the Euro on the UK?
“I hate to think what other “justifiable wars” he will try and get the EU to be involved in”……………………………….
I shouldn’t worry he’s got ABSOLUTELY no chance of getting the French or Germans anywhere near any shooting and the Italians are losing interest as well and by that time WE won’t have any surplus troops to deploy anywhere they’ll all be comitted to Afghanistan
He’ll have to do a little deal with Mandy’s
commieRussian friends — “Tell them they can have Poland and Czecho back, Peter, Obama doesn’t want them now, and it’ll serve that chippy bastard Klaus right”Done and dusted, no way will this be held until the election,
be great won’t it, bLiar back as the hate figure, him & mandlebum creaming up, just as I predicted,
Squaddies lives being lost to create a democracy in Afgan, fuck all for britons, with a small capital b,
Anyone left in the country with a backbone.
Nope, none at all
I’m really looking forward to the day in a couple of years when we’ve left the EU and the Irish have to cope with proper customs to ship any exports they have left across the UK to reach the channel ports. Otherwise it’s a long trip round Cornwall. We can make life quite difficult for them.
We could charge them for using our territorial waters… good way of getting back some of the £££££billions we’ve paid into the EU.
Oh yes, and would you PLEASE move those caravans off our countryside?
Time for the army to do it’s duty?
Larouche on Bliar – the current ‘Iago’ of/for the Oligarchy – LEST WE FORGET WHAT HE’S RESPONSIBLE FOR (imo and allegedly, of course):
http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=11936
Today feels like that day at the start of the Iraq War when anyone with any sense knew we had been sold down the river. I feel LIVID, and underneath really sad.
I think David Camerons response is right , you could tell a lot of money had gone into the yes vote this time around , and with the irish economy in such a state the spun job fears was just enough to tip it . Also the euro currency had a certain inevitability , as you can no longer take a “punt” . In brussels it will be welcome to the family for Ireland . CW opposition to Lisbon and move to being out is not just right wing reactionary bile , this final stage of the project is being sneaked upon us , wich tells you alot about it in the first place .
the pied piper (or even the prime mentalist) is blowing his charming melody that it will be a progressive move to build a more inclusive international social structure , he has conceeded to a TV debate to celebrate , wich makes me wonder why he was holding fire . This picture of a sort eutopia of trade and single bindng currency for all is very deceptive , all ready in the pipe line is a massive increase in contributions , the unelected president it all looks like a quango , a vast blob that will take in more resources as it controls our lives , not by the threat of a vote but by state control . What we are angry about with nu labour will simply be scaled up in the EU .
ireland goverment will be a posh plebacite , it will talk like a supreme achievemnt , and it will get its alloted share of the wealth, for that is what the socialist project is , your alloted share as dictated unto you .
It may be a decade before they realise what they have done , they will not control there boarders , interest rates will be whatever they are told they are , they will have to do business with whom they are told to , whatever is in the EU compendium of socialist foreign policies . It will move to being a high tax economy , the celtic tiger will be as extinct as the DoDo , the free spirit of running your own affairs will die . The elites will take there share and they will be unquestioned in there spending and projects .
As for rest of conference so far I like it , i thought lansleys idea was so new its hard to appreciate it , but at least he teased somthing out into an area that will increasingly take up more general taxation as the Uks population ages , The labour attacks were predictable , but then again its a long time since any of us has heard more personal responsibility comming from a government minister even if a shadow one .
If the socialists had been faced with1940 , they would have created a vast quango , spent all the money and gone to the IMF before a spitfire even took off . mind you the anti bullying spin would have made us a pushover anyway for the third reich
What response ? To do nothing, send out emails and hope for the best ?
Inspiring leadership and not complete confirmation that he’s a lightweight wimp
Dave`s email still leaves the door open for betrayal.
It is certainly far from a sound uncompromising statement. For Dave, however, it is slightly better than usual.
We’ve been betrayed by Labour and the Libdems on Europe,never forget that, so far we only got the conservatives and UKip in our corner on this.
It looks as if Dave has been ignoring advice from Andrew MacKay and Julie Kirkbride for once. Well done in that regard but why has the Bromsgrove vacancy not been advertised on the candidate`s list? That is very disturbing.
OFFICIAL RESULT ** RATIFIED BY 67.1%
** OFFICIAL RESULT ** RATIFIED BY 67.1% **
Well, no open count, who knows if its the real figure or not, would not trust them as far as i could throw them.
***OFFICIAL RESULT**IRISH HAVE NO SPINE**
I have just sent this to the conservative party.
Dear David,
Please bear with me on this. I’m not a good writer, and I want to make my feelings on this clear.
Where does the authority to take decisions on behalf of the people come from? Throughout history, it has been those with the most effective means of violence who ruled by force. With the advent of democracy, that situation changed. Authority no longer comes from the barrel of a gun but from the ballot box.
When elected, labour included in its’ manifesto, a pledge to hold a referendum on the EU constitution. They have reneged on that promise. The renaming of this text to ‘Lisbon treaty’ does not absolve them of the responsibility to live up to commitments made to the UK people.
Until we, the people of the UK, have a vote on this profound change to the way we are governed, any and all legislation and effects from this are democratically illegitimate. Therefore the people have no moral obligation to follow any EU legislation. I for one will not.
If we are abandoning democracy, please ask yourself, what is the other option?
N.B. I used to be a labour supporter. I would like to see a major party win the next election as the minor parties are unlikely to be able to effectively run the country. Having said that, I will not be voting for any party which does not explicitly state that there will be a referendum on the EU constitution / Lisbon treaty question.
If we don’t have democracy, we have nothing.
Many thanks for you patience on this and I look forward to a commitment to having a referendum, regardless of the ratification status of this treaty.
Yours sincerely
Darren Strevens.
Afraid the only thing that will come out of this is the House of Commons will be turned into a museum or car-park and the MP’s will be just Councillors in a large County Council.
Well done Darren. thank you.
Your quite welcome. To be honest, I do not believe it will change anything, I don’t even expect a reply, but it needed to be said.
BTW, I like the name!
Well done on the note to Tories Darren.
Have you visited tpuc dot org and watched Brian Gerrish, John Harris and Albert Burgess videos down LHS – if not, you should. They explain a lot of how we’ve ‘got to here’ and what we can do about it.
Darren let us know if you get a response won’t you?
Will do. I guess it will be monday at the earliest, if they reply at all.
Blair as EU President will just about ensure a complete wipeout for Labour at the ballotbox next year.
By the time Cameron gets in, there will be no UK govt, it will be effectively run from Brussels telling us all what to do.
Come on! I can’t wait any longer for an election!
9 months
7 months
Ireland have voted on the Lisbon treaty, they voted against ratification. There were no pre conditions of vote until we get a yes, so the 2nd vote should be declared null and void. Cameron should give Britain the vote on the EU referendum based on the outcome of the Irish first vote and if that is not now possible, then he should give Britain a referendum on whether we stay in the EU or pull out completely, but don’t hold your breath because Cameron never intended to be in a position to fulfill his promise.
fuck off back to UKIP you single-issue tosser
fuck off back up Ken Clarke’s backside you traitorous Europhile scum
No more Charles Martels, El Cids or Vlad Tepes for us by the looks of it.
Goodbye Europe.
THE GAME’S UP. IT IS’NT FUNNY ANY MORE!
We’ve been sold down the river by the Lab/Lib/Con traitors,Cameron won’t do anything he’ll will just join troughers united wisteria club.
The Irish were BOUGHT OFF!!!!! We will all live to regret it!
The Irish will certainly live to regret it.
Now they have voted yes, the money they poured in for the buyoff will stop and they will be left to stew like the rest the of europe now.
Lets see how you feel about the EU in about 3 months.
It would be funny if Intel and Microsoft fucked off to Poland now they have the result they wanted.
least we get rid of Gordon now he’s served Mandy’s purpose.
Vote UKIP for five more years of Gordon Brown.
Vote Cameron for five more years of Tony Blair
Vote UKIP or Dave if he sorts himself out and if that doesn’t work , fight.
Will electing Euro councillors be the only impact we have on our future from now on?
Least labour aint got too many of them anymore.
*MEP’s even
What can I do to fight Tony the Liar and Europe?
Time to string the old longbow methinks. It worked before.
Goyim are mentally inferior to Jews and cant run their nations properly. For their sake and ours, we need to abolish their governments and replace them with a single government. This will take a long time and involve much bloodshed, but its for a good cause.
I don’t give a fuck,just as long as Jacquifivebellies and the other outrageous troughers get prosecuted.
They stole from us.They betrayed us. They fatted themselves at our expense
especially Jacqui.
Sister’s spare bedroom in Peckham? Don’t make me laugh.
How’s the private prosecution going Guido,any news? How much have they raised?
Emperor Blair will soon rise with a crown of stars, just as was foretold in revelations. Western Civilization is now doomed in Europe.
why don’t you try posting this on Labourlist ?
their comments on the referendum have no UKIP bloggers ( afraid ? )
but you’ll be in the company of one C Hardwidge and make his posts seem rational.
The words “Liberty, Equality, Fraternity” have spread to all corners of the earth.
These words installed peace, quiet and solidarity throughout all Goyim of the earth, and thus weakened their strength.
As you will see later, this helped us to our victory: it gave us the possibility of getting our hands on the master stroke, the destruction of privileges and power of their royalty. That royal class was the only defense the Goyim had against us.
On the ruins of the eternal and heir-based aristocracy of the Goyim we have set up the aristocracy of our educated class headed by the aristocracy of money.
The entry qualifications to this aristocracy are based on wealth which is dependent upon us and on knowledge, which also comes from us, especially from our learned elders who have provided much inspiration.
I’ve been arguing for a televised debate between the party leaders all along. The Tories didn’t want one because they have no policies.
I don’t believe gordon will join the tv debate.
He will say he’s going to up front and then behind the scenes he will be prevaricating – he will only debate with cameron not clegg , he will only use a certain chairman (ie nick robinson) , he will want to choose the questions and exclude some subjects.
He will make it absolutely impossible for there to be any agreement on how the debates are to be held right up to the day of the election.
This man is a crab he goes sideways at everything.
Nell,a debate with these three debating with each other,will only be like a family debating over the colour of the curtins,red,blue or yellow.
SKY have already said they will empty chair anyone who doesn’t agree
I love to see gordon empty chaired – it says everything there is to say about him – not worth his weight in salt.
I’m not a christian or religious but……………
I agree with the posters here who say Bliar is the human manifestation of satan.
As for Cameron, he is a lame duck
The treaty will be ratified before we gat a chance to boot Brown out of No.10
Our future slavery is now guaranteed
The UK is finished
Get out while you still can
really, where too?
Ireland ?
France ?
Iraq?
Thailand sounds good.
Either Thailand or the Philippines. I’m off after the election
Dubai .It is a great time to buy.
Nah. G. Glitter tried that.
Stand and fight – it’s the only way.
Damned right. Lets fight and get our wonderful country back!
This country is finished.
In 20 years from now we will be just an annex of Europe filled with the second generation offspring of the mass migrants from Europe & Africa & that chithole they call the Middle East.
Brown / Blair & the ZanuLabour asswipes need to be hung for treason.
I have to stand and fight – I’m too old to emigrate.
my country i aint going anywhere
So in the end it will be civil war.
Never mind.
What form of rule is to be given to these communities other than that despotism which I shall describe to you later? We shall create a strong central government in order to gain a stranglehold on those communities.
We shall thoroughly regulate all aspects of the public life of our subjects with new laws.
These laws will withdraw, one by one, all the privileges and freedoms which have been permitted to the Goyim; and our kingdom will be distinguished by a despotism of such magnificent proportions that, at any moment and in every place, it will be in a position to wipe out any Goyim who dares to oppose us, either in words or by actions.
I’m getting a bit tired of your pathetic attempts to stoke up anti-semitism. It’s Saturday. Is it not a good day to have some proper fun like everyone else?
Agreed, Anonymous.
POZ, if you’ve got a serious point to make, or an opinion to express, do it clearly and concisely. Either that, or give us something that makes us laugh. These cryptic, possibly anti-semitic posts are a waste of pixels.
none are so blind than those that refuse to see it
See what? Make your point. Clearly.
Itz clear enough to me, but certain things can presently be only hinted at in this oppressive climate – some countries (eg Germany) such open thoughts can get you a spell in prison.
Fuck !Hardwidge is back.
Feed not the troll
So it really is “CAM THE SHAM” on the Lisbon issue. He can’t hide behind east european SKIRTS for ever.
Really
why’s it not Brown the referendum-reneger or Clegg the trappist’s problem ?
Whereas its perfectly acceptable for Labour to hide behind Irish skirts?
Democracy: the people’s will to vote.
EU Democracy: the people will vote as dictated.
Not forever,just until we kick Zanulabour out.
“But we have one policy at a time, and we will set out how we would proceed in those circumstances if, and only if, they happen.”
This is a bit weak, isn’t it? Either of two things can happen, and a sensible party would have a policy for both eventualities.
On the same basis the Tory defence policy would be: If someone attacks us we will decide how to proceed. Until then we’ll do nothing.”
He is being very sensible.Why muddy the water just before the conference?
he is on top,we can now have our say on what Labour have been up to.
No point wasting all the TV coverage on something he can’t, at the moment
do anything about.That’s what Zanulabour want.They would much prefer the news
bulletins to be on the Tory Euro prob,rather than on what a total enept bunch of
cocks they have been.
Very true. Newlabour are desperately hoping that there will be a ruckus at the tory conference about Europe.
So the best way to avoid a ruckus is not to have a policy for the most likely situation on taking office?
Larouchepac: “Gordon Brown, architect of the entire bubble….” not that any ‘right-thinking’ person believes either he or bliar have ever actually made a decision about anything – they just follow orders:
20mins in:
http://www.larouchepac.com/lpactv?nid=11936
At the same page – scroll down to:
“The Satanic God Behind Obama’s Policy” which has Bliar as the current Iago for the ‘Oligarchy’ and which re-visits the manipulation of ‘we the people’ in the run up to the invasion of Iraq.
President Klaus is a member of the Mont Pellerin Society whose luminaries included Ludwig von Mises and Friedrich Hayek.
Here’s hoping he will shine the light of liberty upon this despicable union.
As Hayek wrote about the Road to Serfdom, the EU will be the superhighway to serfdom. Line up for micro-chipping and barcoding…
Firstly – UKIP have got about as much chance of forming a government or even getting MPs into double figures for that matter as it does raining tespoons – it’s bloody “fantasy island” time if you think otherwise
Secondly – Voting UKIP will injure the Tory Vote and therefore quite probably result in either a “hung parliament” and Lib/Lab Pact Mk2 or another 5 years of Labour either way both parties are pro europe and have absolutely no intention of doing anything about abrogating the Treaty or holding a referendum whatever they put in their 2005 Manifestos
Lastly – people complain that Cameron is “copping out” of the issue – well he’s the only hope any of you europhobes have got to get ANYTHING done about Lisbon
So the two options are clear: –
Vote UKIP – split the Tory vote and achieve absolutely zilch other than probably another 5 years of Labour and Blair
Vote Conservative and have a chance of something being attempted on Lisbon however difficult its chance of success
ever had the feeling you’ve been conned
yes
when I saw you advertising butter
Vote UKIP, get Brown!
Vote Conservative, get rid of Brown!
Exactly.
Vote Tory or get Brown. It’s the only game in town
I now feel justified in making jokes about intellecually-challenged Irishmen.
How do you brain-wash an Irishman? Pour soapy euros in his wellies.
The BBC headline on the frontpage strikes me as one of the most biased I’ve seen in a long time.
In the latest ticker:
“Tory Leader David Cameron fails to give a promise of an unequivocal referendum…”
and in the main news box
“Tories maintain referendum stance: David Cameron refuses to commit to holding a referendum…”
For starters, this is at most “No change in current policy from Conservative Party” but has been twisted into a personal attack on Cameron, using the word “fails” in one instance, leading the reader to believe that immediately demanding a referendum is the morally right decision, and Cameron is in some way shifty for not immediately demanding one (despite still demanding one unless circumstances change)
That’s reinforced by the second line, “David Cameron refuses to commit” — which is tantamount to screaming “liar, liar, pants on fire.”
I hope Cameron shuts the BBC down on his first day in number 10. Lies, lies, and more lies, from the bastard telly tax.
The BBC needs castrating..the marxists there think they are fireproof….but they will learn otherwise after the next GE.
Exactly. Conservatives never forgive or forget. Remember how Maggie dealt with the Miners after they brought down the Heath government.
Just let Norman Tebbit lose with a chainsaw
‘loose’ even
Perhaps it will be the EUBC (UK Branch) by then and Dave (or we) will have no say in it’s running.
Classic text analysis and quite correct. The choice of syntax to create negative associations: ‘fails’ and ‘refuses to commit’ carry a not so subtle subliminal signal.
How about:
DC says there will certainly be a referendum if ratification not completed before GE
DC says that all options are open if the Lisbon treaty is ratified and in force prior to a GE as the new Government would be confronted by a ‘fait accompli’.
I am sure a little black book is being kept to wage revenge when the opportunity presents, and that day will come.
BBC now says,
“Tories maintain referendum stance”
Suppose someones had a word. Unfortunately it’s now 1:30am, any potential damage has been done.
I now read that the Lisbon Treaty makes provision for the appointment of a President and a Foreign Minister.
Is it coincidence that mandy said a while back he would have liked a spell as our Foreign Secretary?
If Bliar gets that Presidency expect mandy to have a plush private jet waiting the morning after the GE to fly him off to Europe for his grand new post!
Someone has to STOP these Huhnes from gaining so much power.
THEY HAVE SYSTEMATICALLY ABUSED THEIR POSITIONS AND HAVE COLLECTIVELY CREATED FEATHERED THEIR OWN NESTS.
I Predict WW3 staring in Europe.
Every major conflict has started in Europe.
The fall of egypt (the invaders came from eastern europe) the expension of the roman empire.
The medieval era (the dark ages was the early medieval period) including all of the crusades against the middle east (the pope loves land and loot)
The seven years war (also known as the french and american indian war, which was close to being the real first world war) leading up to all of the modern day conflicts of the last two centuries and what is being started this centuary.
The EU is only part of the project, the same old game is still being played.
It’s called power, greed and not giving a shit about others (those who start to care get kicked out of the world aristocracy pretty damn sharpish.)
You can’t change shit by voting for the status quo and the elite are ensuring that you can’t change shit by ensuring the status quo is taken out of your reach.
The illusion of freedom has been lifted, you are property of theirs. Either get used to it or change it (big hint, they need you more than you need them.)
BLAIR AND HIS CABINET SHOULD ALL BE ARRESTED FOR STARTING AN ILLEGAL WAR!
Comtesse du Pied Nu.
Back window, demain,
VOULEZ VOUS UNE GUERRE? NON à TONY BLAIR!
We must hold our nerves and keep faith as we have done before in Britain and we will win in the end. The EU wants us to fight between ourselves, don’t help them and don’t help Labour and Limp Dems.
Trolls from Liebour we get hourly but trolls from the Conservatives is a new one,somebody must be worried.
MG, I’m assuming you’re a Conservative. So I’ll tell you this;
If you want Cameron to get a landslide, and at the same time wipe out UKIP and the BNP, then he only has to do one thing; unequivocally say that he will call a referendum on the wider nature of our relationship with the EU – not just Lisbon. And do it sooner rather than later.
The uproar from the EU, ZaNuLiebor and Al-Beeba will be immense, but if there’s one thing guaranteed to bring this country together with a real fighting spirit it is this issue.
What has Cameron got to lose? If he *doesn’t* do it and lets Lisbon go though he’ll (a) find Blair is telling what to do and (b) be forever remembered as a quisling.
If he does do it however, well …
It won’t be much of a fight when 80% are on side
LAbour’s not worried about losing the Sun, because they still have the BBC to present their lies to the public.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8288652.stm
To Darren Strevens.
I sent a letter to Cameron on the 30th May asking him what his position was on a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty and reminding him that this was what democracy was all about irespective of how the Irish might vote.
I also asked that if they replied that I didn,t want meaningless statements just straight answers.
They replied on the 3rd of June with a long email of the most meaningless junk I have ever read.
You will probably get a reply but my guess is it will be waffle.
Iain Dale says that of 2200 conservatives polled, according to Conservativehome, 8 out of 10 want a referendum on the Lisbon Treaty regardless of whether it gets ratified before the next GE.
Dave needs to take note.
I remember standing in a village on top of the White Cliffs with a bottom of list, down from London, Conservative MEP candidate. We were looking across the channel to Calais (it’s about the right distance to look at Calais).
Me – You can see Europe from here.
Candidate – But we’re in Europe here!
Me – You’ve got a lot to learn.
I reckon 7 of those 8 want us out of Europe, if the Conservative Party adopted the views of the majority of its membership there would be no need for UKIP to exist.
So UKIP exists just to piss the conservatives off ?
That’s the weakness of your case, you’re not arguing with the Lib Dems or Labour but with people who are essentially euro-sceptic but don’t agree with your tactics.
Take your argument to the euro-enthusiasts and convert them.
Hang on. UKIP are the default party representing our ancient ‘constitution’. Its the others that are the radicals. We’ve not had a vote on this yet, every deed since my childhood has been done surreptitiously. I was brought up to understand about our Monarchy, Parliament, law and sovereignty. My view or acceptance of that hasn’t altered and I don’t want it altered.
PS-If – YOU want it altered let’s have a fecking vote on it!
Unfortunately the new lab folks have driven a coach and horses through our unwritten constitution and will continue to do so. This means we will need to write one if only for basic protection of the citizens ( and no I don’t like any more than you do ). However if we do write one we can make it as difficult as possible for the politicos to crap over us in future.
PS since your obviously a big UK supporter why is your name not Ivor Blackastonmartin ?
sorry being modded.
Not aware I had not asked for a referendum. Even if its post ratification it gives the UK a strong moral argument with the rest of Europe and the consequent mess makes it harder for bureacrats in future.
But even if there is a vote, what makes so many so sure the answer will be NO?
Yes we know that if the vote was tomorrow it would be a clear No, but the vote will not be tomorrow, or even next month.
Events and economic realities have a habit of happening, at times which always suit the needs of the establishment. Even when they sometimes do not, the establishment knows only too well that the people always come running back to the establishment when times get hard. In fact the harder things get, the more the people do so. They also know they have the entire MSM eating from their hand, so can spin any event the way they wish to spin it. A case in point being this recent Irish referendum.
Far from seeing their economic situation as the fault of the EU, they have trusted their own establishment when they have dishonestly and repeatedly claimed that the EU is the only solution. Irish people are in reality no more stupid then any other people. Therefore the establishment will try the same thing here however much the £ plummets or other soul destroying realities get. The worse the better, as far as the establishment are concerned, and they know only too well that things are going to get very very much worse, especially once Ozzy gets to open the books.
Therefore far from seeking a referendum, people should be publicly ignoring or loudly protesting every piece of legislation that comes from the European Commission, and doing so without exception. I know they will not do anything of the kind, because the establishment have been behind every large public protest the BBC have ever given coverage of. I would very much like to be proved wrong, as I would so many other things, we shall see.
It’s democracy Paddy, but not as we know it.
Still not a tory though.
If we’re not part of Europe what on Earth will be a part of. The good old USofA may still be a powerful nation, but they are a declining one. The Commonwealth? Sorry guys they don’t want us. The future world currencies are the Renminbi and the Euro. I am really sorry all you Eurosceptics that wanted the Euro to die but it has not and WILL not. We should be a part of this.
Europe is a bureaucratic nightmare, but aligning one to far right extremists, and having a stated aim to leave will not help solving the problems.
You remind me of an old German I once met. He admitted that he had been a member of the NAZI party and justified that with, “well there was nothing else to belong to.”
Yes and how many more nazi’s ran around after the war denying that they had ever been members?
How many of these labour voters in a few years time, when labour’s legacy of scorched earth and economic destruction becomes clearer, are going to do the same?
We now know how a whole continent could sleepwalk into National Socialism. Because stupid people thought it was a good idea.
Sorry, that should be renamed International Socialism.
Fantastic. I’ve never been compared to a Nazi before. SHould go down well with the neighbours (I work in Germany because the Hoons at NuNoLabour and Thatcher destoyed the car industry in the UK.
Looking forward to the Tories tearing themselves apart this week.
If it was a choice between Europe and the US I would choose the Yanks.
I trust them slightly more.
actually the basic thread is we admire nations who look after their own people ( US, France, Germany ) our politicians don’t
Well why not NAFTA then if we must belong as some poodle somewhere whith I happen to believe we don’t need to..
at least the car’s got better
why not an Aston Martin ?
The euro’s damned expensive though. Soon be on parity with pound. Europe probably engineering this in advance of us being finally manacled to the European dictatorship.
fraid not
Brown had an overvalued Euro for most of the last 10 yrs at € 1.50 when it should have been closer to € 1.30.
But it helped keep inflation down while killing manufacturing jobs.
The decision to move HP sauce to Holland must now be looking pretty daft.
I Believe Hp Is Now in Romania !
You daft old bint.
The euro is gaining against the pound because the bank of england is printing pounds faster than gordon brown can spend them.
Think of it like this:
Imagine you were providing a service that no one else could. You could charge a large amount for it. Then imagine you are cloned several billion times and your clones all provide the same service as you. The price drops.
Why do people always want us to join a club and then tell us we will suffer dire consquences if we don’t,EEC=good sort of, EUSSR=very bad.
free nelson mandela, free the european people, free palestine, free the world from the elders of zion
Sorry to tell you this but nelson mandela has been free for decades.
One down, three to go
Yes, oh yes!
Bill Posters is innocent
BBC Pravda can barely contain its glee at the Irish EU bribe vote.
Cameron’s equivocation invites votes for UKIP.
All these Europhobes get on my tits.If we pulled out can you really see the likes of BMW, Mercedes , Renault , Saab, and countless other multinational organisations turning around and declaring that ”we will do no business with the UK” ? No , of course not.So thats your main argument blown to fuck then.
Sam claims to be an expert on the Lisbon Treaty, then claims that all the power in the EU lies with the Commission. My understanding is that there is a 3-way share of power in the EU. The main problem is that the Council of Ministers (including the relevant Minister of the UK Governemnt) meet and decide in SECRET. Everything the Commission or the Parliament does is put into the Public domain.
Explain yourself Sam
And who is our commissioner. Unelected by any chance? Is it baroness Ashton still
I thought being a soverign country came before any treaties or do we now have treaties before a soverign country or should that be troughing a soverign country away for your own benefit.
Cameron better pull his finger out and give us a straight statement about Europe.
The British people would be against the B liar, against the treaty, against the euro and against Europe.
He would gain in popularity if he bit the bullet and came out wholeheartedly against Europe. I think he would get in with a huge majority. But has he got the balls?
An interesting article in the Saturday Mail Weekend magazine
“Gordon tastes of muck. Gordon Brown is even worse. It’s a revolting name – a mixture of mud and Marmite. Absolutely disgusting.
Tony, on the other hand, tastes of desiccated coconut. And I don’t mind Martin, which has a Bakewell tart flavour.”
Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/article-1217118/The-man-taste-words-Gordon-Brown-tastes-revolting-Tony-Blair-tastes-desiccated-coconut.html#ixzz0Su22yiPU
WTF?
Frankly, I have to say that there has been some right bollocks written today, some of it from posters who really should know better.
As far as can be estimated at this time, the turnout to Vote was around 50% as against 53.1% last time. The loss of the NO vote can be firmly placed in the Courts of EU lies and distortions of truth and fact, and the very badly managed NO campaign, which had hung a NO vote on some very dubious claims, such as Catholic Ireland to introduce abortion clinics, to abandon its neutrality, to drop its minimum wage to just a euro eight-four an hour, etc. etc. etc.
Indeed these claims were later seen to have been little more than scaremongering and did much to damage the NO vote campaign as the EU in various guises took such stupid claims apart.
In my view the Irish voted YES for a couple of reasons. Firstly they are sick to the teeth with corrupt Government, and have seen what benefits EU membership brought with. Unfortunately they have failed to appreciate that the current fiscal situation is also part of what being within the EU brings. Had the NO campaign been more credible then this may have been more of an issue however the damage was done so much of what the NO campaign had to say was treated with suspicion. UK sit up and take notice.
Like the UK, the Irish have also been bombarded with pro-EU propaganda, which also helped.
Now look at the UK situation. Do you honestly think that 50% of the UK population will turn out to Vote on the Lisbon Treaty ? Do you really ??
Every General Election from 1945 until 1997 saw broadly 70-75% of the population voting. That figure dropped sharply to 59.4% in 2001 before rising to 61.3% in 2005.
The reason for the dramatic fall was established to be down to the fact that people saw little point in voting when the incumbent had such a massive majority. Even by 2005 when people were waking up to the fact that Labour were screwing both the Country and the Economy a large majority stayed at home even though doing so was and has since then hurt them massively.
During the 2005 GE, I was talking to a young woman who was on the checkout at our then local supermarket. She was appalled with Bliar and what Labour were doing to the Country. When I asked if she was voting she said “No….there’s no point, they are all the same and in any case my single vote won’t help”
There is a massive hill to be climbed with regards to the Lisbon Treaty Vote.
Firstly, a sizeable people cannot be bothered to come out to vote Labour out of office, even though those same people know they are hurting and know that any Labour success would make them hurt even more. People have lost the interest in Political matters because all Governments have promised one thing in Opposition and then never delivered in Office.
Secondly, there is a very sizable chunk of young to middle aged people who have lived all their lives, or at least the greater part of their lives within an environment where the EU has been a daily part. They have also been subjected to a huge amount of propoganda both covert and overt at school and at work, and socially. YES they get annoyed by EU stupidities but these in many cases turn out to be the British Civil Service doing what it does best and churning out masses more Regulation than is either sensible or indeed needed. This sizeable population thus does not see the EU for what it really is. Indeed they actually DO NOT CARE !
Thirdly, the Lisbon Treaty has been couched in very vague terms. All EU Legislation of any import is simply so that it can be read in many different ways, and thus there can be no concerted opposition because all the Opposition does is to argue over detail and interpretation. The Left does not have to do anything like this, and indeed is well organised in its response across the EU.
Talk to three different experts and you will get three very different views as to what it actually means. This is further compounded by EU propaganda which itself is designed to play down and concerns, something it does quite well, especially with the likes of the Liberal Elitist press.
Fourthly it does not help when even some of our Heavyweights, such as Ken Clarke are so Pro-Europe. All this does is to divide up any Right Wing opposition, making it harder for anyone to identify with anyone other than UKIP, who incidentally actually pose a very serious threat to the Conservative Campaign, because together with the BNP they will do more harm to split the Right Wing vote than any small Party can do to Labour. Hence why Labour are now going on a concerted “hearts and minds” campaign to to stifle the impact of their potential vote splitters.
Fifthly, unlike Ireland, we have a high percentage of poorly educated people, certainly within the working class and a smaller but still sizeable chunk of the Middle and Upper Middle classes. This is because the Educational Establishment in the public sector has been under the control of the Left since the 70s, and they have wrought their iron well. I was talking with a poster on another Forum who HATES Mrs Thatcher. It turns out that he is 15 ! Now he was not even born when Mrs Thatcher was in power yet he has been brain-washed through the school system to the stage where he believes without any shadow of a doubt the “The Tories” are the enemy of the working man for God’s sake. This is all down to lies, distortions, and deliberate disingenuity by Leftist leaning teachers, who unfortunately have had the run of the state education system for some 40 odd years now.
Happily some clear water can be seen as the latest batch of children emerging from school have now lived throughout their lives under a Labour Government, albeit you would not believe the misconception of history and historical fact that has been distorted and twisted beyond all recognition by many Left Wing teachers. (Common Purpose ring any bells ?)
The point here is that many people in their 20s/30s and some 40s are unable to intellectually grasp the wider impact of the Lisbon Treaty. Certainly many people younger, who have been brought up with news and information being delivered to them in “60 second soundbites”, do not have the intellectual ability to assimilate anything that cannot be churned out in Sun-Speak.
There is little point in debating the finer detail points, which of course are where the danger lies – remember “the devil is in the detail”, because these will not be easily understood and in any case they can be somewhat complex when it comes down to the fine detail.
So for all those of you who have bnerated the Irish, just think on. Can you see 50% of the population coming out to Vote on Lisbon ?
And of those who do, how many will Vote YES simply because they have been psychologically conditioned in favour of the EU through our educational system.
Well that’s me well and truly scared.
I thought the latest scare story was that the educational establishment is rife with B&P members. As a teacher who favours neither extreme ‘left’ or ‘right’ (voting for a decent candidate if there is one, not parties) and who has taught in five secondary schools between Leeds and Brighton… honestly, I simply don’t recognise this leftie brainwashing stereotype folk keep harping on about. Shite teachers yes, agreed. Too many. But I think you’re overestimating the effect that school has on the current generation.
I wear myself out trying to convince a large minority that it’s worthwhile learning anything at all. If it’s an effort or they can’t have it ‘now’ many of them really don’t want to know. I’m a good teacher so I get there in the end, but it’s all uphill.
Thanks for going to that trouble and length od thought. Very worrying. However, there are some deeply intelligent people who remain patriotic and who may help as now the horror is reality. I’m heartened that many conservative members are eurosceptic and I can’t believe 100% of labour supporters are pro-euro integration.
Now that the Irish have decided-there may be some truth coming out on what it actually means for Ireland, workers, etc.
The Irish Yes vote is mainly as a result of their poor economic condition; they are one of the few countries who are worse off than us.
They basically voted for more money from the Eu.
They want more “celtic tiger” basically.
I’d like more celtic pussy myself to be honest.
I understood it was the poorer Irish who mainly voted No, and the ‘middle classes’ who mainly voted Yes.
People have not stopped voting because they can’t be bothered. They know that the only realistic chance of removing labour is to vote Tory and they also know that both these parties are essentially the same; do as we say, not do as we do, laws are for little people, have you seen my new duck-house? Tories are pro EU. Heath, Thatcher, Major are all traitors to their people after introducing illegal, unwanted legislation. War is imminent.
How Is It That The Smallest Part Of Great Britain Can Decide The Fait For All Of Us ? It Dosen’t Seem Right !
Yeah we should never have given europe back to the french.
Or Let Germany Reform !
Ireland has not been part of Great Britain since 1922. You must be one of those passing through the Leftist educational system.
Great Britain actually only consists of England, Wales and Scotland. The United Kingdom includes the same Countries, with the addition of Northern Ireland.
The fact that the UK Passport refers to “Great Britain and Northen Ireland” should have given you a clue.
Geographically, it is correct to refer to the British Isles and mean the islands of Great Britain and Ireland. Politically only, the Irish Republic is now seperate.
Yes but that is not what was said. The poster inferred Ireland was part of Great Britain which neither the Republic, nor Northern Ireland are.
Right on
I say sod Europe and await the return into office of our allies in arms in the
Neo-totalitarian Republican movement. Obama will be wiped out in one term,
grant my word. We have the Corparations, the arms dealers, pharmaceutical
Companies, all mighty financial institutions and the might of the truthsayer of
justice Murdoch and enough power, muscle, media and financial might to
bash the centre ground into submission.
Only then will we be able to shove namby pamby ‘human and worker’s rights’
where the sun don’t shine. Just imagine, fellow totalitarianists, a nation of real
justice!!! The commies in Russia acnd China and our brothers in South Africa
failed because they weren’t tough enough and didn’t lock enough people up.
The US locks up a much higher percentage of it’s own people than those
softies and gets rid of wooly novelties like ‘fair trials’ for it’s enemies. True
Neo Conservative totalitarianism is about locking people up and throwing
away the key. Sod ‘reasonable’ doubt. If he or she looks ‘guilty’ and the
judge, two fellow peers and the local prosecutor agree it’s more than 40%
likely, lock the bleeter up!!He probably did it. And hey, if not, well he probably
would have done pretty soon so what the hay.
More guns too would be an idea. 32,000 more people die a year from guns
in the US than us and most of Europe combined. But the lily livered are wrong
to insist on more gun control. There are many positives. Think about it.
The US didn’t get to the top of the world by being the gang that couldn’t
shoot straight, did they? If we scrapped the NHS and pensions we could arm
our great land with rocket launchers and shotguns aplenty. With that kind of
power the trotsky’s in Brussels wouldn’t stand a chance. Viva la world
domination, Guantanamo and Bush. They’ll be positively hankering for him
soon, you’ll see.
Time for your meds.
Oh, come Rick, be a bit more original than that. I’m not asking Wildean
rebuttals for Claridges sake man, but surely a cornball Haguean quip shouldn’t
be too hard too far beyond your remit. How I do love his witty asides.
Goes down paricularly well with a brandy and an after dinner speech I find.
Loves to ‘Party Down’ too. Should have him seen him at the Notting Hill
Carnival the other year, totally plastered. Rather spiffiing moves I
thought. He can really cut a rug that man. How he never got elected is
beyond me. Tut Tut Britain. Anyhow……
We’re looking forward to a repeat performance in May. Your New Labour
Trotsky’s will be kicked into touch. Hurrah. What a night that’ll be.
Sing along now “David Cammers is having a Party, bring the champers and
the charlie”. Good night. Uh, chocs away……………………………..down the
hatch as they say!!!!!!!!
Nurse!!
Sky News Says That 4 Out Of 5 Tories Want A Referendum So Watch What You Say Dave (Nice) Or You Could Find Yourself Still In Opposition !
[...] Cameron email – "We Want A Referendum" Cameron : We Want a Referendum – Guy Fawkes' blog [...]
8 out of 10 conservatives want a referendum regardless of whether the Treaty has been ratified.
Dave has a fine line to walk next week at his conference. I hope he’s listening.
BBC Headlines – “Torys Split Over Europe”
The orders have been issued from the bunker…Pravda TV news must rubbish tories at all cost….tories = doubleplus ungood….all stories eminating from tory conference to be “rectified”….
The orders have been issued from C.C.O. and Ken Clarke.… must rubbish tory eurosceptics at all cost….eurosceptic-tories = doubleplus ungood….all EU dissent stories eminating from tory conference to be “rectified”….
That, of course, is going to be Labour’s line of attack next week in an attempt to disrupt the tory conference.
I have a feeling they are going to fail.
Meanwhile gordon, I hear, is off to Northern Ireland on Monday, grandstanding in an attempt to grab the headlines.
Not sure what for perhaps the IRA are going to handover weapons or something. Oh wait !! they did that for Blair!
He’ll be off to Afghanistan on Tuesday or Wednesday and bombarding the White House with demands for an Omaha meeting on Thursday.
He’s obsessed with PR and proving to the world, through the media, that he is hyperactive. Except when there’s a crisis then he goes into hiding. What a wally!
Nell, its not a fine line though is it? He’s got 80% of the population behind the right side of that line
8/10 of everyone in England wants a referendum on the Eu, whether tory or otherwise, and the reason we won’t get one is because 8/10 want to leave the eu.
Via BBC latest from Vaclav Klaus
But the Czech president today sent a message that in a sense was telling the Tories not to depend on a Czech delay. He said that after today’s referendum “there will never be another referendum in Europe”. He was then asked whether he had a message for Britain. “I am afraid,” he replied, “that the people of Britain should have been doing something really much earlier and not just now, too late, saying something and waiting for my decision”.
That’s gonna stir the Tory Conflab innit
How do you confuse an Irishman?
Put him in a round room and tell him there’s 10 euros in the corner.
There will be the usual load of noise. briton moaning, as it always does.
Last election there was a choice, vote for a load of known liars, where people have died for lies, or, make a principled change.
Guess what they lied about the euro vote, what a fucking surprise.
But hell, we believed them, the rotters, not being british that, have to play by the rules.
What rules, the house price rules.
It’s said the public get the government it deserves, WRONG, the government got the people it deserved.
Welcome to modern britain, where *owell is king.
Roll on the olympics, that’ll show the world what we can do (sic)
who is owell?
Thatcher Must Be Gutted !
All tHose Years Refusing To Bow To The EU !
That Took Courage And A Strong Backbone !
Then Along Comes A Spineless Coward
And Pisses It All Away !
and then he becomes president of Europe
She signed Maastricht, that gave away more powers than any other treaty
WHERE IS THE DEMOCRACY ?
NON OF THESE SHITHEADS THAT RUN THE EU ARE ELECTED !
And When This Scum Government Suffer The Worst Defeat In British Political History
They Will Leave These Shores In Droves For There New Life Troughing In The EU !
Which makes me think that many within europe will soon get pissed off
They can get as pissed off as thye like but THEY have made themselves the bed they will lie on, and THEY have given life to the monster that will devour them if they oppose it.
In the words of the Police song “Wrapped Around Your Finger”
I will turn your face will turn to alabaster
when you find your servant is your master
Sorry not sure what happened there !
It should read…..
I will turn your face to alabaster
When you find your servant is your master
Has Anyone Heard That In This Lisbon Treaty There Is A Clause That Makes It A Criminal Offence To Say Derogatory Things About The Eu Or To Oppose Any Of Its Rulings ?
I’ve read that. It obviously outlaws UKIP.etc
Reminds me about the period after the American civil war when the south was ”rehabilitated” and they where finally allowed to retake positions of authority.
Indeed.
if you want to say Barroso is an oily deviant tyrant, then now is the time to do it.
How the fuck can dancing round a bastard totem be moving forward?
Dave’s message:
One thing is for sure: I won’t ever be flying Ryanair again, after their support for the EU constitution. I don’t suppose they’ll worry about my average of 6-8 flights per year, but if others boycott them as well, we could start to send a small message that we really do not want this Ryanair-supported european superstate.
Companies are there to be supported or boycotted. Ultimately, the market will decide. We are all part of the market, and our custom is far more important than our votes.
OTT.
Just to lighten the tone a little, a story now on Aunty Beeb regarding the lovely Harriet HarmMen.
“Labour’s deputy leader Harriet Harman is co-operating with police over claims she left the scene of a minor car accident.”
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/8289159.stm
Nightmare before bed time.
Let’s say Brown is no longer on medication.
Let’s also say that He needed something to get the country behind him, something that would rock the voting public, something that could get him back into office.
Let’s say after Camerons main speach to conference, Brown went live to the BBC and said He had decided ‘THE COUNTRY IS GETTING A REFERENDUM!”
The tories would be in dissaray, the public (certainly enough of them) would be back on side and his old enemy Blair would be well and truly scr*wed.
If Brown and Zanu were to have any chance whatsoever of winning an election, this really would be it.
Sweet dreams.
Nightmares more like
That would be a beautiful dream, not a nightmare, I’d vote no in the referendum and then vote Conservative later on…
Cameron’s got enough on his plate with UKIP and the obverse scenario is if he says to the EU, “We never had a referendum, we’re going to have one as we promised we would as did every other party. We don’t consider ourselves bound by a previous government’s illegal actions and we’ll let you know pending on the referendum result.”
If they fine us, we withold our contributions arguing that it was Brown who signed it without authority to d so, so take it up with him and the Labour party.
This is the crazy Tory logic.
UK should not be part of a block of other countries because we lose our sovereignty and decision making powers to another body.
But Scotland, ales and Northern Ireland MUST remain part of the UK because it is the union. Their decision making powers are made by Parliament in London. What about Scottish, Welsh and Irish sovereignty? If the Tories are so concerned about national sovereignty, why not independence for them?
Answer that and stay fashionable.
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